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The Southeast: Mod Justice Or Mod Justice?

  1. Adjustment Team Skyl3lazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffraider View Post
    PL quite literally brings the minimum amount of dudes
    Oh yeah that's why 3000 of the 4000 in system were CFC right, it was just a lone 200 PL dudes against the world

    I literally do not give a fuck about who won, I havent logged onto eve in a year, but man saying 'if you bring less dudes we will' has been a way to lose wars since 2004

  2. Crashlander Koshie Naranek's Avatar
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    Yes the main fight was a lag fest tidi mess. But in the past 24 hours how many engagements took place? All of those were fine without the massive tide (smaller fights yes) with a lot of fun to be had.

    Everyone poo poos the big fights in 0.0 yet the overwhelming majority fights do not involve tidi and are a lot of fun.

    "OMG 0.0 sucks cause of the three or four really big fights per year" Yeah lets ignore the other 99% that are fun.

  3. Don't try to solve serious matters in the middle of the night Fast Rap Tupac Srbija's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Oh yeah that's why 3000 of the 4000 in system were CFC right, it was just a lone 200 PL dudes against the world

    I literally do not give a fuck about who won, I havent logged onto eve in a year, but man saying 'if you bring less dudes we will' has been a way to lose wars since 2004
    I can never get tired of a gooncoon crying about numbers

  4. Super Moderator Lorren Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koshie Naranek View Post
    "OMG 0.0 sucks cause of the three or four really big fights per year" Yeah lets ignore the other 99% that are fun.
    Yea TiDi today sucked but 90% of the fights I get into are fun. If others aren't having fun in 0.0 they aren't doing it right.

    That being said, sov has been fucked and today brought that back into clear focus. I'd love to see a fluid sov system with no timers and little to no grinding, Make the fights that matter based off reaction time not timers.
    Your posting has been Adjusted

  5. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Oh yeah that's why 3000 of the 4000 in system were CFC right, it was just a lone 200 PL dudes against the world

    I literally do not give a fuck about who won, I havent logged onto eve in a year, but man saying 'if you bring less dudes we will' has been a way to lose wars since 2004
    For all of you mongoloids that are like this guy and just don't get it here's how this actually works:

    A timer is created, it is simply a number floating in space. These things are created all the time and they just sit there counting down. A timer by itself is fairly harmless, causes no lag, nothing at all.


    Then one side posts a form up timer, if you're in PL our shit does that for you, they autopost, so no big deal, we see it and decide what we're going to form for it.

    Now here's where the lag starts building.

    Because Side A has a timer Side B posts a counter timer. Now side A is nervous so they add a mail or a ping that says they'll need dudes for a fight trying to get more interest in the timer.

    Side B sees this (because everybody is spying on everybody) and does the same.

    This gets ping ponged back and forth for about 20 odd hours until the next morning theres ALL HANDS ON DECK WE NEED EVERY NIGGER WE KNOW WHO CAN FUNCTIONALLY SIT AT A KEYBOARD TO SHOW UP TO THIS NUMBER FLOATING IN SPACE because at some point, CCP gave us TiDi and 3 day fucking timers that allow for this kind of retarded asshattery.

    So now the timer for some inane backwater no nuts system has gone from a number floating in space to soul crushing lag in about 30 hours, if its a weekend, theres literally no hope at all.


    In the way back when, it was simply a timer both sides had an op posted for, what kills the server and the game is the hoopla and fanfare that goes on between timer creation and timer exit. If it had just stayed 2 sides with an op posted you might see a 4-500 man fight that slowly escalates over time while actually fighitng as the sides ping for reinforcements and other groups get wind of the fight.


    So yes, in a way, if you bring less dudes by making less of a big deal about a timer, you will in turn see your enemy make less of a big deal. We've actually seen it in this war, where we didn't call form ups till right before an exit timer so that we could lull the opponent into a sense of comfort.

  6. Whoremonger thatsthejoke's Avatar
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    N3PL has been saying for months (years?) how restofeve coalition has 0 experience fighting with caps. There should've been 20 N3PL supers dead today at minimum, but instead of bringing 100 supers, CFC brought 1,000 domis and proved N3PL right.

    Bring 10% of the dudes in the right ships, and gain a better fight AND a better outcome.

    Also, maybe supercap experience will teach you that DDs aren't horrendously affected by tidi, unlike say...dread guns. GG.
    Last edited by thatsthejoke; 2014-01-19 at 01:59 AM. Reason: rephrased.

  7. Master of Spies Jean Leaner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Oh yeah that's why 3000 of the 4000 in system were CFC right, it was just a lone 200 PL dudes against the world

    I literally do not give a fuck about who won, I havent logged onto eve in a year, but man saying 'if you bring less dudes we will' has been a way to lose wars since 2004
    3000 of the 4000 dudes *were* the CFC.
    In Memoriam RIP Vile Rat

  8. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatsthejoke View Post

    Also, maybe supercap experience will teach you that DDs aren't really affected by tidi. GG.
    This is false, we were only firing DD's about once every 100 minutes in the TiDi. I believe one titan got off 6 today.

  9. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Alidean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wki View Post
    It wasn't the 1500 dudes in system that was the problem. It was the other 1500 dudes.
    it was more like 1200 vs 2800

    lets be honest at least

  10. Have you been Thunked? CAPTAIN THUNK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Oh yeah that's why 3000 of the 4000 in system were CFC right, it was just a lone 200 PL dudes against the world

    I literally do not give a fuck about who won, I havent logged onto eve in a year, but man saying 'if you bring less dudes we will' has been a way to lose wars since 2004
    https://www.pandemic-legion.com/test...af2#LocalStats

    This was taken about 30 minutes before system peaked and just under 4000. So yeah, PL and friends brought much less, bear in mind there were hundreds of CFC and friends who could not get into system. An entire fleet of BL and co caps, all the CFC and friends supers etc...

    You can claim the game is broken if you want, but you have to take responsibility for being the ones who break it.
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  11. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Jesus christ 937 domis...

  12. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Wki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quesa View Post
    https://killboard.ncdot.co.uk/?a=kil...&kll_id=362323 is fairly accurate, from what I can tell. Eve-Kill doesn't work all that well on long battles.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alidean View Post
    it was more like 1200 vs 2800

    lets be honest at least
    Sure thing. There were the domi's, one CFC dread fleet, and the -A- dread fleet, and then what you had. The same thing would have happened if all the domis were replaced by capitals, or weren't even there. There would still be the problems entering the system, the module lag, etc. Anyone that gets set up first has the advantage. Just too many people in the same place.
    Last edited by Wki; 2014-01-19 at 02:03 AM.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  13. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wki View Post
    Sure thing.
    Yes, use a shitty killboard that can't tell the difference between who's on what side as part of your argument

  14. King Dong Richter Belmont's Avatar
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    Has anyone posted a shitty excuse as to why the NC got owned today yet?

    Or is it just "muh node crash" and "muh lag"?

  15. Don't try to solve serious matters in the middle of the night Fast Rap Tupac Srbija's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richter Belmont View Post
    Has anyone posted a shitty excuse as to why the NC got owned today yet?

    Or is it just "muh node crash" and "muh lag"?
    On top of the usual suspects they're also apparently demanding CCP apologize to them for causing their losses, because the node favoured PL&bros over them. Bunch of mad nerds in some stream chat.

  16. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex El Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAPTAIN THUNK View Post
    NC. bringing mad numbers, wow.

  17. Adjustment Team Skyl3lazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grath View Post
    Words
    And then side A spams pings for a timer just as it happens and brings 2000 dudes and side B loses because they didn't. Are you really naive enough to think that this e-honor bullshit will ever be the way people try to play the game when the game mechanics reward and encourage jamming every dude you can in to a fight?

  18. Don't try to solve serious matters in the middle of the night Fast Rap Tupac Srbija's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Terrible View Post
    NC. bringing mad numbers, wow.
    More astounding is the number of PL (and SNIGG#1 bringing 80 members, the highest number of people in 1 corp on both sides) members, especially compared to CONDI numbers, an alliance ten times our size but bringing only 31 more people

    what's the matter goons, lost your taste for sov warfare?

  19. Inconstant Moon swampsparrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    And then side A spams pings for a timer just as it happens and brings 2000 dudes and side B loses because they didn't. Are you really naive enough to think that this e-honor bullshit will ever be the way people try to play the game when the game mechanics reward and encourage jamming every dude you can in to a fight?
    We won and we didn't bring 2k dudes...you did...

    e: Every time the CFC loses an engagement in which they outnumber their opponents we get this same old song and dance of "THIS SHIT ISN'T FAIR GODDAMN CCP/SERVERLAG/SENTRYDOCTRINE/ETC IS BROKEN AND BOOOHOOHOOO"
    Last edited by swampsparrow; 2014-01-19 at 02:19 AM.
    We could be on the other side of EVE and still make it to a fight, TiDi or no, before the first DD timers had been on cooldown. It makes not a single fuck where in EVE PL actually is, if we're the reason you wont use supers, then you wasted your money ever buying them, end of discussion. - Grath

  20. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    And then side A spams pings for a timer just as it happens and brings 2000 dudes and side B loses because they didn't. Are you really naive enough to think that this e-honor bullshit will ever be the way people try to play the game when the game mechanics reward and encourage jamming every dude you can in to a fight?
    Yes because thousands of people regularly respond to every fucking fleet ping right, people just spend 3 days beating the fucking drum because they like to be poetic in pings.

    Or are you a fucking jizz mopping retard that doesn't get that even if they do exactly that, if theres not DAYS of fucking build up that the actual turn out will be much lower than this 4000 man bullshit that breaks the game?

    In your situation, Side A spams pings before the op and gets nowhere near 2000 dudes because no coalition has 2k dudes that respond instantly and so Side B now starts spamming pings and they also get nowhere near 2000 dudes because again, no Coalition has 2000 dudes that respond instantly and the resultant mass of less than 4000 people fight. That number is generally around 2000 people total for the fights we've had down here for long ass slug fests that last hours and hours.

    So please, take your retard grasping logic and stuff it up your ass, thanks

  21. SHADOO OUTSIDE NOW progodlegend's Avatar
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    God, I'm still all giddy inside. Today was a happy day.
    Now that you have read my post, just remember that I am a respected member of CSM 8.

  22. Adjustment Team Skyl3lazer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grath View Post
    Yes because thousands of people regularly respond to every fucking fleet ping right, people just spend 3 days beating the fucking drum because they like to be poetic in pings.

    Or are you a fucking jizz mopping retard that doesn't get that even if they do exactly that, if theres not DAYS of fucking build up that the actual turn out will be much lower than this 4000 man bullshit that breaks the game?

    In your situation, Side A spams pings before the op and gets nowhere near 2000 dudes because no coalition has 2k dudes that respond instantly and so Side B now starts spamming pings and they also get nowhere near 2000 dudes because again, no Coalition has 2000 dudes that respond instantly and the resultant mass of less than 4000 people fight. That number is generally around 2000 people total for the fights we've had down here for long ass slug fests that last hours and hours.

    So please, take your retard grasping logic and stuff it up your ass, thanks
    Man you are hostile as fuck that your fleet fight might not have been won on your own merits. Your bullshit libertarian logic here is that if both sides don't take an obvious advantage, then fights will be better. Maybe that's true, but you will never have the case where neither side doesn't take the obvious advantage. Like I said the first time, it's some e-bushido bullshit that will literally never happen so long as sov warfare works the way it does.

    But just ignore me, I'm sure CCP is totally competent and you totally outskilled your opponents today.

    e; I get, you hate large fleet fights, but the bottom line is that CCP wants them to happen, and they will continue to happen so long as that's what the mechanics dictate.
    Last edited by Skyl3lazer; 2014-01-19 at 02:31 AM.

  23. Promiscuous Xolve's Avatar
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    I eagerly await the fallout CCP's token 'we do not get involved in fleet encounters- reimbursement denied' cookie cutter petition replies cause.


    Just think- if you actually fit your dreads to do some damage, you might have actually killed a super or two.

  24. Have you been Thunked? CAPTAIN THUNK's Avatar
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    I'd be interested to know what the 1000 domi's did all fight other than ask themselves "Why aren't our dreads firing?"
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  25. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Man you are hostile as fuck that your fleet fight might not have been won on your own merits. Your bullshit libertarian logic here is that if both sides don't take an obvious advantage, then fights will be better. Maybe that's true, but you will never have the case where neither side doesn't take the obvious advantage. Like I said the first time, it's some e-bushido bullshit that will literally never happen so long as sov warfare works the way it does.

    But just ignore me, I'm sure CCP is totally competent and you totally outskilled your opponents today.

    e; I get, you hate large fleet fights, but the bottom line is that CCP wants them to happen, and they will continue to happen so long as that's what the mechanics dictate.
    I don't hate large fleet fights, I'm just a realist, CCP wont' be re writing this code any time soon, so that leaves the burden on the players, and from one player on one side to another player on the other side im telling you that this is our fault just as much as its thiers, we know what will cause it, and yet we do it every god damn time and expect a different result.

    Like theres this insanity from anybody who died today to petition CCP about their loss, knowing that sueprs and titans have died in lag fights, t3 fleets, all of it, the petition responses are universally the same: Get Fucked you jumped in. This is the kind of compete mind fuckery that we as players have perpetrated on each other, we believe that all these people will help us win the fight, to a certain point we're right but past that point it only hurts us, but do we care, nope, just like a junkie we want it all and we want it now. We believe we have the right to bring all these people, and that if something goes wrong the game company should replace our losses even though we had a really good idea that terrible shit would happen.

    And here's the best bit:

    If the server hadn't held, and crashed instead, the CFC main line member would instead be crying about how CCP saves the N3 fleets again.


    The only people that will save fleet fights in EVE are the alliance leaders who call the ops in the first place.

  26. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Wusti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grath View Post
    The only people that will save fleet fights in EVE are the alliance leaders who call the ops in the first place.
    If you take nothing else from what the wise sage Grath tells you - take THAT.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    Man you are hostile as fuck that your fleet fight might not have been won on your own merits. Your bullshit libertarian logic here is that if both sides don't take an obvious advantage, then fights will be better. Maybe that's true, but you will never have the case where neither side doesn't take the obvious advantage. Like I said the first time, it's some e-bushido bullshit that will literally never happen so long as sov warfare works the way it does.

    But just ignore me, I'm sure CCP is totally competent and you totally outskilled your opponents today.

    e; I get, you hate large fleet fights, but the bottom line is that CCP wants them to happen, and they will continue to happen so long as that's what the mechanics dictate.
    Yet you still ignore the central issues:

    1. Poor CFC leadership. Holy shit, its not like these mechanics and tactics are new.... Goon & Co have used them for years. Once again though, Goons were afraid to commit the time and more importantly, the right ships to the fight. Compound that with how you all timed the entry and you fucked yourself over but good.

    2. Content Creation - People will participate in these massive lag fests if they believe (or are convinced) that their contribution matters, it will be fun and will make the other side bitch and cry. CFC going full retard and once again shying away from another big fight where they again had numerical superiority just reinforces the fact that CFC has no leadership worth mentioning. Mittens writing out a script in his boxers and reading it to the masses doesn't really count. CFC needs someone who will get them fired up as Goons used to be.

    I'd rather stick a fork in my eye then go through that .1% shit again but the spinning it generated from CFC has been pretty hysterical.

  28. King Dong Pilious's Avatar
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    I for one see at least a dozen glaring mistakes that ensured you lost that fight, don't blame CCP don't blame drone boats don't even blame super caps in large numbers you retards made a whole host of mistakes.

    I am still waiting for mittins or Villy to say thank you for me killing all the Condi Naglafars.

  29. This is harsh. Evaluate me Gothic Light's Avatar
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    So if I'm following this thread correctly, people are suggesting that CFC doesn't attempt to win fights with a 3:1 number advantage that has carried them through the last 3 years of warfare but no longer works (If the fight today in hed is any indication). That would mean they would have to fight with just 2:1 odds, which would likely result in losing some fights. Maybe in the process learn something. Maybe even adapt their fleet doctrines, put themselves into situations where individual pilot skill might matter. Like if you don't have to wait 45 minutes to cycle a mod. This is sounding dangerously close to a situation where a fight might be fun for both sides.

    Yeah.. you are all fucking dumb that's NEVER going to happen.
    :what:

  30. Adjustment Team Skyl3lazer's Avatar
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    I'm laughing pretty hard that you think I'm whiteknighting goons or anything here.

    When CCP creates an environment where it is expected that these large fights happen, and when they promote the fights, and when they attempt to even support the fights - it is their fucking fault, and nobody else's, when the fights don't work. I have no idea what, if anything, the CFC's leadership is doing, because I'm not actively playing EVE right now. I'm not trying to defend their actions, but this is some weird Stockholm syndrome shit if you think CCP is doing their job correctly here.

    I guess this whole forum is on the anti CFC circlejerk pendulum swing though so maybe my thoughts dont matter at the moment.
    Last edited by Skyl3lazer; 2014-01-19 at 03:09 AM.

  31. King Dong Pilious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    I'm laughing pretty hard that you think I'm whiteknighting goons or anything here.

    When CCP creates an environment where it is expected that these large fights happen, and when they promote the fights, and when they attempt to even support the fights - it is their fucking fault, and nobody else's, when the fights don't work. I have no idea what, if anything, the CFC's leadership is doing, because I'm not actively playing EVE right now, I'm not trying to defend their actions, but this is some weird Stockholm syndrome shit if you think CCP is doing their job correctly here.

    I guess this whole forum is on the anti CFC circlejerk pendulum swing though so maybe my thoughts dont matter at the moment.
    no one is saying this is how it should be, we are simply stating you try to manage to the limitations of the game, and stuffing every warm body with a pulse into a system to try to win does not actually help you when your up against an opponent like N3 and PL. Either CFC learns something or they will go the same route as the old NC, simple as.

    Also Manny I yelled at a titan pilot on our coms to DD digi, your welcome. He was shit fit.
    Last edited by Pilious; 2014-01-19 at 03:11 AM.

  32. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex vyshnegradsky1's Avatar
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    I have to admit, today could of played out very differently. Cramming 1000 people into maelstroms or even megathrons would of provided much more alpha than that of the sentry drones. Assuming 60 minutes of actual gameplay due to Grath mentioning 6 doomsdsays going off, that's alot of carriers that could of been volleyed off the field by the CFC/RUS. The capital fleet didn't even have to be there, they could of gone off and melted some structures elsewhere whilst the N3/PL cap fleet was tied down. There's no point blaming what happened tonight solely on crippling tidi, I think there were other decisions made that adversely affected the outcome for the CFC/RUS team. Hopefully lessons were learnt and the next time something like this happens it works out better for us.

  33. Promiscuous alphastarpilot's Avatar
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    Oh boy I cant wait to read the next 10 pages of who is to blame for this welp news @ 11!

    EDIT: Just passed 420 posts, all you stoners take a hit for me o7.

  34. King Dong Pilious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphastarpilot View Post
    Oh boy I cant wait to read the next 10 pages of who is to blame for this welp news @ 11!

    EDIT: Just passed 420 posts, all you stoners take a hit for me o7.
    Come join D00M Alpha I will vouch you in brother, you deserve better because I am going to go out on a limb here and state today will cause the -A- failurecascade for this year.

  35. Inconstant Moon swampsparrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphastarpilot View Post
    Oh boy I cant wait to read the next 10 pages of who is to blame for this welp news @ 11!

    EDIT: Just passed 420 posts, all you stoners take a hit for me o7.
    You miss Lucian James don't you
    We could be on the other side of EVE and still make it to a fight, TiDi or no, before the first DD timers had been on cooldown. It makes not a single fuck where in EVE PL actually is, if we're the reason you wont use supers, then you wasted your money ever buying them, end of discussion. - Grath

  36. Glimmung jeffraider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    And then side A spams pings for a timer just as it happens and brings 2000 dudes and side B loses because they didn't. Are you really naive enough to think that this e-honor bullshit will ever be the way people try to play the game when the game mechanics reward and encourage jamming every dude you can in to a fight?
    u got an issue?


    here's a tissue

    lollllllllllllllll

    Whoever FC'd for CFC, I'm sorry. You're about to get lit up by le martini.
    Last edited by Lorren Canada; 2014-01-19 at 05:49 AM. Reason: doublepost
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  37. Becalmed in Hell pugnax's Avatar
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    Still no real explanation of why CFC cynoed into the grid and not at a deep safe.

  38. Glimmung jeffraider's Avatar
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    CFC got blobbed, end of story
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  39. What Good Is a Glass Dagger? Sorrowsbane's Avatar
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    It's almost like CFC have forgotten what they did to kick TEST out of their fountain home - setting up early, taking every POS...

  40. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyl3lazer View Post
    I guess this whole forum is on the anti CFC circlejerk pendulum swing though so maybe my thoughts dont matter at the moment.
    Thats not what I'm saying at all and if its what you took from my posts today then I wish you'd re read them.

    Today the CFC nutted up and did exactly what everybody said they wouldn't have, and I'm pretty sure the blood from this fight had the server not shit its self would have been chest deep by mid day. Nobody can take that away from them and very few people outside of them would ever willing jump into a full N3/PL super fleet fleet. Hell BL turned around and went home and left their friends to die.

    So no, not anti CFC, what I'm legitimately saying is that you have to look at what the game can take and operate in those bounds.


    We've reached a point where the fight to see who was better established between Money and Numbers can't happen, the unstoppable force has finally ran into the immovable object. If the situation was reversed, and the nearly 3k CFC members were in system first and we jumped in the effect would have been nearly the exact same, only we'd have been on the receiving end of the big black cock that lurks in the server code like a Detroit rapist looking for a place to happen.


    There was a time when people didn't bring it all in right off the bat because shit like this used to be an 'every fight' type of thing. We either resort to that or we deal with shit like this all the time from now on, thats what I'm saying.

  41. Inconstant Moon CivilWars's Avatar
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    We will obviously never know, but for some reason I just feel like if the roles were reversed, and the CFC had the "wrecking ball" setup early that PL/N3 would have still come in, done it properly, and the end result would have been very similar to what happened today. By that I mean the CFC would still have lost nearly everything, and PL/N3 wouldn't have lost much. Just my opinion though.

    I still have some friends in the CFC and it was quite hilarious seeing one of them go from, "We are about to drop the hammer and kill the entire PL/N3 (super)cap fleet" to "Fucking PL/N3 cheating and exploiting game mechanics. Fuck you CCP!"

  42. Glimmung jeffraider's Avatar
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    Can you please refer to Black Legion. as the Down to Flee coalition at least?



    Quote Originally Posted by CivilWars View Post
    We will obviously never know, but for some reason I just feel like if the roles were reversed, and the CFC had the "wrecking ball" setup early that PL/N3 would have still come in, done it properly, and the end result would have been very similar to what happened today. By that I mean the CFC would still have lost nearly everything, and PL/N3 wouldn't have lost much. Just my opinion though.

    I still have some friends in the CFC and it was quite hilarious seeing one of them go from, "We are about to drop the hammer and kill the entire PL/N3 (super)cap fleet" to "Fucking PL/N3 cheating and exploiting game mechanics. Fuck you CCP!"
    If the CFC put supers and titans in first?

    it would have gone not at all the same
    Last edited by Lorren Canada; 2014-01-19 at 05:51 AM. Reason: doublepost
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    Basically what I am taking away from this all is that Pandemic Legion, the four-time Alliance Tournament winners and Kings of Lowsec(tm) alongside the N3 Coalition aka "We Play EVE Online" Coalition beat the holy shit out of the NC in an actual supercapital fight today over a very critical system.

    Literally nothing that hasn't been done before.

  44. Inconstant Moon CivilWars's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffraider View Post
    If the CFC put supers and titans in first?

    it would have gone not at all the same
    That's what I am saying. The CFC side wants to blame it all on CCP, and not take any of the blame for their own mistakes. In my opinion PL/N3 would have done things much differently than the way the CFC did today, and thus still would have killed the CFC and held the field. I think that the PL/N3 side would have won no matter who was there first, but again, just an opinion.

  45. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Wki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffraider View Post
    If the CFC put supers and titans in first?

    it would have gone not at all the same
    There would be dead titans and supers. But I doubt we'll all agree on whose.
    Last edited by Wki; 2014-01-19 at 03:57 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pilious View Post
    no one is saying this is how it should be, we are simply stating you try to manage to the limitations of the game, and stuffing every warm body with a pulse into a system to try to win does not actually help you when your up against an opponent like N3 and PL. Either CFC learns something or they will go the same route as the old NC, simple as.

    Also Manny I yelled at a titan pilot on our coms to DD digi, your welcome. He was shit fit.
    No you didn't retard, travis found and had cycled his DD before you even knew he was on field.
    In Memoriam RIP Vile Rat

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    Quote Originally Posted by CivilWars View Post
    That's what I am saying. The CFC side wants to blame it all on CCP, and not take any of the blame for their own mistakes. In my opinion PL/N3 would have done things much differently than the way the CFC did today, and thus still would have killed the CFC and held the field. I think that the PL/N3 side would have won no matter who was there first, but again, just an opinion.
    If you read my post I'm saying we shouldn't blame it on CCP.

  48. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grath View Post
    So now the timer for some inane backwater no nuts system has gone from a number floating in space to soul crushing lag in about 30 hours, if its a weekend, theres literally no hope at all.
    To be fair, this was a fight against -A- for HED. It's just part of the lore at this point.

    The next time there's a fight for NOL, or C-J6 (if Russians ever take it again), there will be 4k people fighting to get into system. Someday we'll probably see 5k+ trying to get into VFK.

    Today was a shit day for Eve, and today was a glorious day for Eve. That's just the way shit happens. There's not enough virtual glory in the virtual universe to make me join these kinds of fights, but fuck me if I don't appreciate the fact that there are 4k+ nerds willing to (non-dictor-related) waterboard themselves for 12+ hours for this kind of thing.

    Again, it's not great gameplay, it's Lore. I don't mock these nerds, I appreciate these nerds. I love these nerds.

    Today was a shit day for Eve, and today was a glorious day for Eve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CivilWars View Post
    The CFC side wants to blame it all on CCP, and not take any of the blame for their own mistakes.
    I'm hearing their blame is going to shift to Provi for hitting the cynojammer and telling PL in the first place. And I guess Provi taking advantage of a dozen retreating CFC/Rus capitals didn't go over so well also. Understandable, as it's easier to BurnProvi2014<tm> than it is to accept responsibility for failure.

  50. The church of Batman the redeemer needs you Elise Randolph's Avatar
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    January 18, 2014 – HED-GP More Like HED-GG

    "700 Dreads? No sweat"


    The war in the South between RUS/CFC and PL/N3 has been burning hot with very little headway made by either side. Any advances made by the PL/N3 group were done so on the heels of a careless –A- mistake. After the new year –A- let their home system of F4R fall into final reinforced because they simply couldn’t install a jammer upgrade. –A-‘s bacon was saved by their allies who proceeded to put a combined 2500 man cap/subcap fleet into F4R to guard the system from downtime – about eight hours. PL/N3 were simply astonished by this showing and simply couldn’t fight; catastrophe averted for the ever downtrodden –A-. After this showing, a plan was formed. Essentially the plan revolved around eliciting the same reaction, but this time actually being able to fight. Manny, the PL Campaign Commander for the Southern defense, went straight old-school and pulled the pages from The Old Days of warfare. HED-GP, an important but non-essential entry system into Catch, is plagued by a lack of moons: a mere six. Up until now the narrative of the war has been: if there is a jammer, PL/N3 simply cannot match the numbers of RUS/CFC and the system is defended. Control of the jammer leads to control of the sytem on both sides. To subvert this fact, slowly but surely PL/N3 took control of all six of the moons in HED and proceeded to reinforce the system. –A- were caught off guard when they went to anchor the jammer and found no POSes to anchor it on. Pulling another page from the Book of Old Days, PL/N3 secured the system hours before any hostile formups and deployed their Wrecking Ball doctrine – a doctrine that combines Titans, Dreads, Supers, and Slowcats in such a way as to minimize the super-killing bumps with Titans and Supers shrouded by Carriers. The gauntlet was thrown; HED-GP could only be saved with a similar capital and supercapital showing from RUS/CFC.

    As happens ever so rarely in Eve online, the stars aligned and a truly awesome capfight was on the horizon. Surprisingly, RUS/CFC were chomping at the bit for this fight. The combined PL/N3 Wrecking Ball fleet consisted of some 500 Archons, 100 Dreads, 170 Supers, and 70 pivotal Titans – a force of nature in its own right and the largest such fleet assembled by this group. RUS/CFC responded in a huge fashion, though, ready to punish PL/N3 for this gutsy move. RUS/CFC sounded the horns and rallied a whopping 1800 subcaps, 500 Dreads with 200+ ~surprise~ BL+Misc Dreads sitting one jump out. All 700 Dreads were DD tanked with a close range fit – the most downright punishing Dread fleet assembled in recent memory. This was augmented further with ~30 Titans and ~150 Supers . Capable, for sure, of putting the PL/N3 Wrecking Ball fleet to the fire. PL/N3 were stuck in their own bubbles; backing down was not an option. Strategies were formulated while PL/N3 sat waiting for the oncoming storm.

    PL/N3 did have two huge advantages – being loaded in the system, and having their synergistic Supers who were accustomed to working with one another in these types of fights. While CFC and RUS did have equal number of Supers, the RUS bloc prefers shield Supers while CFC – like the rest of Eve - have armor. Since HED-GP is only a two-gate system, strategically RUS/CFC could have brought their Dread fleet in at an SBU and raced the PL/N3 fleet at the IHUB. Given the ludicrous amounts of DPS that 1800 subcaps and 500 Dreads could pump out, the race would be a close one – not even needing the split-tank Supers. Kill the SBU, and PL/N3s efforts would be for naught; the hours of waiting and preparation would amount to one huge goose-egg. And, of course, being bubbled would mean that the RUS/CFC fleet would be immune from any harassment whatsoever. As I mentioned before, these types of Capital slugfests are the unicorns of Eve PvP combat – an FCs dream. Killing an N3/PL Wrecking Ball fleet would show once and for all that the Kings of Supercapital Combat were in fact mortal. On top of that, a punishing loss would simply cripple PL/N3 for a non-insignificant amount of time before the ships could be replaced. On the day of the B0TLRD Accords being announced –an agreement between the CFC and PL to make a cartel around space ownership – these types of fights would be even /more/ rare. A figurative unicorn that dined of four-leaf clovers.

    The RUS/CFC fleet had the numbers. Their plan was simple – come into system with subcaps and cyno their close-range Dreads into the PL/N3 Wrecking Ball and then unleash havoc in what would be the largest and bloodiest Capital fight Eve had ever seen. A crude plan, perhaps, but no doubt effective. All that was left to do was execute. While RUS/CFC vehemently argue against all things drones assign, they opted to bring drone-assigning Dominixes to the fight. Over a thousand of them. As they entered local PL/N3 were surprised by the turnout and, after doing some quick math, feared that they would lose the structure race to the Dreads and Domis alone. The combined RUS/CFC fleet were not here for a strategic advantage – the tower coverage meant that even if they did save the system PL/N3 could just put the system into reinforced and flaunt their Wrecking Ball again - instead they were out for blood . Smug messages of condolence between friends went out, notably to Sala Cameron who showed up in a Ragnarok. While the Rag was bait fit, there was no way it was going to survive 150 supers, 30 titans, 500 dreads, and 1800 subcaps. “RIP to your 4th Titan, sorry in advance~”

    The RUS/CFC fleets left the SBU and came onto grid with the PL/N3 Wrecking Ball fleet at the IHU. Suspecting that the RUS/CFC strategy would be to use their close-range Dreads to bump Titans and Supers out of the Wrecking Ball formation, PL/N3 dropped a Cyno Inhibitor on themselves forcing the RUS/CFC fleet to take it out. After about 30 minutes of 10% tidi fighting RUS/CFC traded ~50 Domis of their 1000+ for the Cyno Inhibitor – a fantastic trade for the subcaps. Now came the tricky part – getting the 500 Dreads, 200 Supers,30 Titans, and 200 reinforcement Dreads into local with some 2700 already in it. Jumping onto the same grid with 2700 people is always a dangerous proposition. In The Old Days this resulted in many welps, and this was on a scale simply never-before seen. The RUS/CFC fleets either forgot the lessons of old or were simply overcome by greed and took the daring approach to cyno all of their Dreads on grid. Not only on grid, but actually inside the PL/N3 bubbles. Brazen. The call was made, the cynos deployed, and the Dreads began to jump. On the brink of Supercapital Armageddon, all hell broke loose.

    PL/N3 command channel lit up; “what the fuck did they just do?! They’re cynoing into our bubbles with their subcap fleet on grid?!” The shock and awe would have to take a backseat, though, and PL/N3 quickly went to work breaking the fleet down into 5 distinct cores each shooting their own target. If they were to win they absolutely had to clear Dreads at a frenetic pace. This would be the only play PL/N3 had: clearing DPS before losing all of their repping power. The PL/N3 pings went wild: “Fight is on, when you die pod yourself to Amamake and come back in a new Dread – cyno chains up”. Fast reshipping was the best hope to clear damage, and the cache of Dreads and Carriers was ready to be depleted. Organized chaos from PL/N3 saw reports that the 5 groups were cutting through the RUS/CFC Dreads with ease – the DD tanks weren’t effective and Titans, which were split into pairs, were able to single-shot Dreads. Hearkening back to the old days, strange things began to happen. The RUS/CFC Dreads would simply vanish after taking damage. Others would remain invulnerable. The Dreads, visually stuck in a warp-tunnel by the RUS perspective, were materializing in HED and then being magically transported back to where they came in F4R. The node creaked to a halt, 25 minute module lag from the PL/N3 perspective. Drone assign simply broke. Credit to CCP on a day where most will blame them, the node did stay functional in the face of 4000 people on grid.

    The RUS/CFC Dreads were showing up in clumps of 100, vanishing again before dying. After about an hour of this confusion (six minutes of elapsed real time), all of the RUS/CFC Dreads began to materialize in earnest. The 25 minute module lag, however, meant that the relatively uncoordinated dread fire was relegated to easily tankable splitfire. The only thing doing significant damage was the Titan Doomsdays – after all 25 minute module lag is irrelevant with hour-long cooldowns. Jumping onto a grid with 2700 people, of which 1800 are yours, is a rookie move by all accounts. It is what saw PL lose the then-largest capital fight in Y-2ANO some five years ago – a fight that CFC were involved in. The same type of fight that RUS experienced fighting NC in Uemon and O20 some three years ago. So a completely abysmal execution changed what was a decent chance at killing a Wrecking Ball fleet into an utter turkey shoot. RUS, dejected by this catastrophic failure, completely gave up on calling primaries. The CFC, equally frustrated at the failed execution, at least tried to make the best of the situation and killed bubbles allowing them to extract the bulk of their dreads. Meanwhile the BL component, the ~surprise~ 200 Dreads, simply opted to go home instead of showing up to the fight after RUS decided to cyno on grid.

    Some three-hundred and fifty RUS/CFC Dreads died between HED-GP and various other systems they panic-jumped too. In return for this hefty price, a mere ~10 N3/PL caps. The same RUS/CFC who had apologized in advance to Sala were greeted with a smug response: “sorry I killed 350 of your Dreads PS I did the most damage”. The old school strategy devised by Manny, Vince, and the rest of the N3/PL FCs paid dividends albeit in a very anti-climactic and drawn-out way. At the end of the day the largest Wrecking Ball fleet ever assembled was able to execute perfectly and completely and utterly devastate the RUS Dread fleet, proving once again that N3 and PL use capitals better than anyone else. In the current Eve climate a 350 Dread loss is not coalition-breaking by any means – the fighting will continue and the South will be ablaze with action. RUS/CFC will have victories and, thanks to –A-, PL/N3 will have their share as well. The fighting is far from over, though it will be months before we see a capital fight of this scale again.

    Related links:
    (Note killboards still updating, about ~50 dreads are still logged off on the HED-GP grid and dying by the hour)
    https://www.pandemic-legion.com/kill...&system=HED-GP
    http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=21454854
    http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=21454122
    http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=21452225
    https://killboard.ncdot.co.uk/?a=kil...&kll_id=362057
    Last edited by Elise Randolph; 2014-01-19 at 04:43 AM.
    True, I have raped history, but it has produced some beautiful offspring

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