CEX.io
Page 16 of 81 FirstFirst ... 61213141516171819202666 ... LastLast
Results 751 to 800 of 4024

2012 US Election thread - slowly going nowhere

  1. The Idiot Bastard Son Internet Spaceships's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Posts
    1,499
    R/P
    0.36624416277518
    Power
    6
    THERE IS A GOD

    In a surprise decision Tuesday, former Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.) announced that he is suspending his presidential campaign, all but putting an end to the Republican primary.

    "We made a decision to get into this race at our kitchen table, against all the odds, and we made a decision over the weekend that while this presidential race is over for me, and we will suspend our campaign effective today, we are not done fighting," Santorum said during an address in Gettysburg, Pa.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1415372.html

  2. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. jimmychrist's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Aug
    Location
    the Clapham omnibus
    Posts
    3,000
    R/P
    2.3753333333333
    Power
    17
    Surprise decision?

  3. King Dong Rer's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jun
    Location
    Indiana, United States
    Posts
    2,172
    R/P
    0.49723756906077
    Power
    8
    And once again, logic and reasoning prevails.


  4. Legitimate Rape Baby
    Joined
    2010 May
    Location
    Living the Hobo life
    Posts
    3,611
    R/P
    0.44696759900305
    Power
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Schwartzski View Post
    I don't want to be entirely misunderstood as I think a lot of what is fantastic about America is our poor and rural areas should be celebrated.

    I'm just afraid for my life when I go there because I'm in a mixed marriage and don't believe in God at all.

    edit: Bill Hicks was a pretty funny guy but his was half-in half-out of his own schtick. He had no problem lambasting stupid people, which was great - then would kind of shuffle and degrade homosexuals in the same manner as the stupid people he professed to hate. I'm going to just chalk it up to him picking his battles. Still a funny dude.
    Oh, quit the histrionics. I live in the bible belt and what you describe is no more prevalent here than in New England (God, Manfred; you're dating a darkie?) where I was born. The biggest redneck state in the union is fucking Maine, anyway.

    Also:

    http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/maga...as-278455.html


    I work in what has long been one of the two gayest cities in the U.S. Yeah, Atlanta. I'm not bragging, as I see rankings on shit like Gay, Color, religion, etc as being part of the problem but If the bible belt (and I live in a pretty rural area out of the city) were so bad, it's unlikely there would be a huge draw for homos.

  5. I'm Only in It for the Money Grim's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    Pizza
    Posts
    3,715
    R/P
    0.39946164199192
    Power
    12
    Yeah, lets not get carried away in assuming 1/2 the US is banjo playing, wife beating, queer chasing, drunks who hoard firearms and await the apoclypse.

    Rural Georgia is very similiar to rural New York. The accent is different, but the people are mostly the same (there is a reason we are a single country you know).
    If you kill enough of them they stop fighting - Gen. Curtis Lemay
    Fear the KKM

  6. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    Actually, I'm kinda sad that noone has actual banjo skills anymore.

    It's pretty much just Bela Fleck and Steve Martin at this point.

    Come on, Appalachia, step it up!

  7. King Dong StevieTopSiders's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Apr
    Location
    TISHU
    Posts
    2,224
    R/P
    1.3938848920863
    Blog Entries
    3
    Power
    11
    I'm from Kentucky, and we're hardly the redneck, fag-haters, and nigger-killers that you think we are. vOv

  8. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Bill Schwartzski's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Oct
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    341
    R/P
    1.0351906158358
    Power
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by StevieTopSiders View Post
    I'm from Kentucky, and we're hardly the redneck, fag-haters, and nigger-killers that you think we are. vOv
    Kentucky is pretty fun. Louisville people know how to fucking party.

  9. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Bill Schwartzski's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Oct
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    341
    R/P
    1.0351906158358
    Power
    3
    And for the record, individual states always have redeeming qualities. The statistics from the census simply show that conservative states have a higher incidence of malady than liberal states.

    I lived in the midwest most of my life. Yes the cool people were extremely cool. Yes in large cities you have hate crimes at about the same level. But by and large conservative states complain the most about welfare, but take the most, etc.


    Edit: relevant to topic: Santorum was never, and will never, be president. At least until some kind of Handmaid's Tale thing happens in this country. He was going to suspend his campaign at some point when they realized there weren't enough Jesus Goblins to vote the guy into office, not by a long shot.

  10. Legitimate Rape Baby
    Joined
    2010 May
    Location
    Living the Hobo life
    Posts
    3,611
    R/P
    0.44696759900305
    Power
    12
    Go to a small town anywhere in the Bible belt. Tell them any of these:

    1. "I'm gay, and I'm for gay rights."
    2. "I'm black, and I'm for civil rights."
    3. "I'm an atheist, and I believe in secular government."
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Schwartzski View Post
    there weren't enough Jesus Goblins to vote the guy into office, not by a long shot.
    You protest much.

    I think you're more likely to run into trouble because of your own demeaning attitude towards people of (any) faith than you would saying you're gay. As it turns out, people don't like being insulted by strangers. Imagine that.

  11. King Dong Night's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Dec
    Location
    Empire
    Posts
    2,062
    R/P
    0.58923375363725
    Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Raketefrau View Post
    Come on, Appalachia, step it up!
    Banjo is more a Georgia thing, they do dulcimer in Appalachia.

  12. Banned
    Joined
    2011 Dec
    Location
    CDIAT
    Posts
    7,823
    R/P
    1.3067876773616
    Power
    0
    So that leaves Gingrich, who already admitted his campaign is in trouble and at this point has virtually no way of winning the nomination, and Romney, who has supplied Obama's re-election campaign with more dirt than he could ever hope to dig up on his own.

  13. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Bill Schwartzski's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Oct
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    341
    R/P
    1.0351906158358
    Power
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Manfred Hideous View Post
    You protest much.

    I think you're more likely to run into trouble because of your own demeaning attitude towards people of (any) faith than you would saying you're gay. As it turns out, people don't like being insulted by strangers. Imagine that.
    That's funny - I'm not actively trying to change laws to fit my religious beliefs in order to force other people to be just like me.

    You should check out Uganda right now, where they're trying to make it a capital crime to be gay. Name me one country where gays are trying to make heterosexuality punishable by death, and I'll buy into your bullshit.

    Or how about the United States in the 1950s, when the Bible was used to make mixed race marriages illegal. If I lived in the 1950s, I would be a criminal based only on my marriage. That was driven by "people of faith".

  14. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    Frank Conniff (TV's Frank):

    Hey, Rick Santorum, don't let the cultural, sexual, and religious diversity of America hit your ass on the way out.

  15. Legitimate Rape Baby
    Joined
    2010 May
    Location
    Living the Hobo life
    Posts
    3,611
    R/P
    0.44696759900305
    Power
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Schwartzski View Post
    That's funny - I'm not actively trying to change laws to fit my religious beliefs in order to force other people to be just like me.

    You should check out Uganda right now, where they're trying to make it a capital crime to be gay. Name me one country where gays are trying to make heterosexuality punishable by death, and I'll buy into your bullshit.

    Or how about the United States in the 1950s, when the Bible was used to make mixed race marriages illegal. If I lived in the 1950s, I would be a criminal based only on my marriage. That was driven by "people of faith".
    Most of us don't care that you're gay, dude. In fact, most people don't care about you at all. What you're saying is akin to me teaching my sons to fear blacks because of the NBP are hating on whitey every day, Maybe I should teach them not to trust Indians (dot not feather) because of the rampant corruption in India.

    What you're doing is using a bullshit reason to justify your hate or fear of an entire swathe of the population. Simply, you've a lot in common with the people you complain about.

  16. King Dong Fartman's Avatar
    Joined
    2007 Jan
    Location
    rock city
    Posts
    4,183
    R/P
    1.0475735118336
    Power
    20
    so tell me obamabots, what are you most looking forward to in a second obama term?

    another trillion+ dollar "stimulus"?

    another 5tril+ added to the national debt?

    another unconstitutional power grab?

    do tell!

  17. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    Quote Originally Posted by Fartman View Post
    so tell me obamabots, what are you most looking forward to in a second obama term?

    another trillion+ dollar "stimulus"?

    another 5tril+ added to the national debt?

    another unconstitutional power grab?

    do tell!
    Let's see:

    The stimulus, TARP, signed into law by W in 2008.

    Ludicrous spending adding to the debt? Take a look at what W spent, especially with the "War On Terror." Easily some of the fastest growth of government/erosion of the Constitution ever.

    Unconstitutional power grabs? Google PNAC. W was all over that shit too.

    And just to be clear, no, I'm totally not looking forward to 4 more years of Obama. I think he's just more of the same bullshit we got with W. Government grows, personal freedoms disappear, same old same old.

    At least Obama di... Well, there was that thing where he....



    Do you honestly think we'd be better off with McCain? For real?

  18. King Dong Fartman's Avatar
    Joined
    2007 Jan
    Location
    rock city
    Posts
    4,183
    R/P
    1.0475735118336
    Power
    20
    Quote Originally Posted by Raketefrau View Post
    Do you honestly think we'd be better off with McCain? For real?
    do you honestly think we'd be worse off?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raketefrau View Post
    The stimulus, TARP, signed into law by W in 2008
    FYI "TARP" and "the stimulus" were two different bills. and you're allowed to vote?

  19. King Dong Fartman's Avatar
    Joined
    2007 Jan
    Location
    rock city
    Posts
    4,183
    R/P
    1.0475735118336
    Power
    20

  20. King Dong Rer's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jun
    Location
    Indiana, United States
    Posts
    2,172
    R/P
    0.49723756906077
    Power
    8
    Person A: Oh hey we're gonna reduce the deficit by a bit.

    Person B: YEA BUT ITS NOT THE WHOLE THING WHAT THE FUCK IS THE POINT?!?!?!?





    If that's the case then why the hell are you complaining about it so much when both parties are increasing spending due to a runaway Congress for the past 10 years?

  21. King Dong Fartman's Avatar
    Joined
    2007 Jan
    Location
    rock city
    Posts
    4,183
    R/P
    1.0475735118336
    Power
    20
    so i'll ask again. what's obama's plan? maybe you're going to dodge and just be against his challenger, not for obama, per se.
    but if you're pulling the lever for him you're for whatever he plans to do in a second term. what is that, exactly? do you even
    know? i don't.

  22. King Dong Rer's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jun
    Location
    Indiana, United States
    Posts
    2,172
    R/P
    0.49723756906077
    Power
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by Fartman View Post
    so i'll ask again. what's obama's plan? maybe you're going to dodge and just be against his challenger, not for obama, per se.
    but if you're pulling the lever for him you're for whatever he plans to do in a second term. what is that, exactly? do you even
    know? i don't.
    Wow if that isn't putting words in our mouths I don't know what the fuck is.

    Maybe I'm against Romney because his plans, and the party "backing him" (using that term lightly), don't align with my political views and social values whatsoever. Your entire party's slogan is "anyone but Obama", well, meet our counter strategy "anyone but someone from your party".

    I don't know what Obama's plans are for his 2nd term, and I assume we'll hear more about that as the general election gets closer. President Obama is far from perfect, but he's a lot better than someone like Santorum, Gingrich, Palin, Cantor, etc.

    Edit: And with respect Fartman I don't expect you to be any different, I'm sure to some degree you're anybody but a Democrat, and that's fine, because if it aligns with your political/economical/social values then I wouldn't expect you to do anything different.

  23. The Ethics of Madness Iratus's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    npc corp... yay?
    Posts
    1,539
    R/P
    0.40155945419103
    Power
    7
    Hahahaha it's nice to see you people struggling to find redeeming qualities on your government options.

    It truly makes it easier to swallow the fact that my country just approved a law making 8 years of prison the punishment for internet piracy, because your government would not sign a trade treaty otherwise.

    Thank you for that, really.
    [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hChYV.png[/IMG]

    "Every rifter counts friend" - VR

  24. King Dong Rer's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jun
    Location
    Indiana, United States
    Posts
    2,172
    R/P
    0.49723756906077
    Power
    8
    Our government never fails to keep little secrets and surprises from us when it comes to foreign policy.

    Its like digging in the couch for spare change, you never know what the fuck you're gonna find when you actually bother to look.

  25. King Dong
    Joined
    2010 May
    Posts
    2,120
    R/P
    0.83396226415094
    Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Fartman View Post
    so tell me obamabots, what are you most looking forward to in a second obama term?

    another trillion+ dollar "stimulus"?

    another 5tril+ added to the national debt?

    another unconstitutional power grab?

    do tell!
    I look forward to having someone in office who doesn't think that corporations are people so we can stave off them voting and openly holding public office for a few more years.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    It truly makes it easier to swallow the fact that my country just approved a law making 8 years of prison the punishment for internet piracy, because your government would not sign a trade treaty otherwise.
    You make it sound as if we're somehow wrong for expecting concessions beneficial to us when we sign a treaty and I think we had a very similar conversation about expecting stuff for free from a national government....

  26. The Ethics of Madness Iratus's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    npc corp... yay?
    Posts
    1,539
    R/P
    0.40155945419103
    Power
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by poaw View Post
    You make it sound as if we're somehow wrong for expecting concessions beneficial to us when we sign a treaty and I think we had a very similar conversation about expecting stuff for free from a national government....
    Heh. Come on, Illuminate me.... how sending teenagers who download music to jail is benficial to the US? I'd like to see that.
    [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hChYV.png[/IMG]

    "Every rifter counts friend" - VR

  27. King Dong Rer's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jun
    Location
    Indiana, United States
    Posts
    2,172
    R/P
    0.49723756906077
    Power
    8
    How else will Ke$ha afford her trampy clothes, make-up, and piercings.

  28. Big slab'a Prussian wurst Malaclypse's Avatar
    Joined
    2009 Jun
    Location
    In the Shadow of the Valley of Posting
    Posts
    4,985
    R/P
    0.86499498495486
    Blog Entries
    1
    Power
    18
    Quote Originally Posted by Rer View Post
    How else will Ke$ha afford her trampy clothes, make-up, and piercings.
    The same way as she does now: sell her ass for money. Just that her videos won't be shown on mtv but rather on +18 channels then. I mean, she already does look like a crack whore.
    Monkeys killing monkeys killing monkeys over places of the ground.
    Silly monkeys, give them thumbs, they make a club and beat their brothers down.

    The universe is hostile, so impersonal: Devour to survive - So it is, so it's always been!

  29. Banned
    Joined
    2011 Dec
    Location
    CDIAT
    Posts
    7,823
    R/P
    1.3067876773616
    Power
    0
    Yes, but she looks like a crack whore I want to put my penis into. That's an important distinction.

  30. Big slab'a Prussian wurst Malaclypse's Avatar
    Joined
    2009 Jun
    Location
    In the Shadow of the Valley of Posting
    Posts
    4,985
    R/P
    0.86499498495486
    Blog Entries
    1
    Power
    18
    Quote Originally Posted by Hilmar Keller View Post
    Yes, but she looks like a crack whore I want to put my penis into. That's an important distinction.
    Speaks for your bad taste.
    Monkeys killing monkeys killing monkeys over places of the ground.
    Silly monkeys, give them thumbs, they make a club and beat their brothers down.

    The universe is hostile, so impersonal: Devour to survive - So it is, so it's always been!

  31. Banned
    Joined
    2011 Dec
    Location
    CDIAT
    Posts
    7,823
    R/P
    1.3067876773616
    Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Malaclypse View Post
    Speaks for your bad taste.
    My cock has never been well known for making good or responsible decisions, I'll admit that.

  32. Truth. As terrible as death. But harder to find Brooks Puuntai's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Sep
    Location
    Inactive
    Posts
    985
    R/P
    0.21116751269036
    Power
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Rer View Post
    Maybe I'm against Romney because his plans, and the party "backing him" (using that term lightly), don't align with my political views and social values whatsoever. Your entire party's slogan is "anyone but Obama", well, meet our counter strategy "anyone but someone from your party".
    To be fair, I would vote for Jon Huntsman or Mitch Daniels, so long as he acts like businessman Mitch, and not GOP Mitch.

    Obama isn't the greatest it is true, but what do you expect when hes backed by a Congress/House that's been against him since the day he took office. Ever since 2010 when Dems lost their super majority hes pretty much been a lame duck president. I don't blame him for trying to do a power grab when hes gotta deal with ~300 filibusters in Congress during his first term. The deficit isn't really his fault as much either, considering we are still funding wars overseas, and the economy hasn't rebounded yet, tension in the middle east(and NK) are at a high point which is hurting gas prices. Not only that any budget he tries to get passed that would help fix that, gets shot down by the House, only because the GOP doen't want to tax the wealthy.

    Romney won't be any better at least from my viewpoint. Since as we saw with Bush, he will still increase the size of the gov't, he won't be able to control the deficit, the economy will still be shit. However main difference with Romney is as hes already stated during his campaign, is that he will only really help out corporations and the wealthy and fuck over the lower class(cutting social benefits for example). He also seems more gungho about bombing the shit out of Iran, as most GOP seem to be, which is the last thing this country needs.

    Edit: Forgot to mention that I'm not on any welfare or social programs, though I'm what you would think of as lower middle class. However I do see the benefits of social programs and as a society I feel its right to look out for others who are in need.
    [B]Join the hunt for Ransomlist! Help us find the Number One Kugu poster!
    [URL="http://Join the hunt for Ransomlist! Help us find the Number One Kugu poster! http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?11270-RansomList-has-gone-AWOL"]http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?11270-RansomList-has-gone-AWOL[/URL][/B]

  33. King Dong
    Joined
    2010 May
    Posts
    2,120
    R/P
    0.83396226415094
    Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    Heh. Come on, Illuminate me.... how sending teenagers who download music to jail is benficial to the US? I'd like to see that.
    It's not (aside from those sweet sweet campaign contributions), but you can't really complain about what your government did because another country asked them to when they had the option of not doing it. That problem falls squarely in the realm of YP instead of MP.

  34. Legitimate Rape Baby
    Joined
    2010 May
    Location
    Living the Hobo life
    Posts
    3,611
    R/P
    0.44696759900305
    Power
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks Puuntai View Post
    To be fair, I would vote for Jon Huntsman or Mitch Daniels, so long as he acts like businessman Mitch, and not GOP Mitch.

    Obama isn't the greatest it is true, but what do you expect when hes backed by a Congress/House that's been against him since the day he took office. Ever since 2010 when Dems lost their super majority hes pretty much been a lame duck president. I don't blame him for trying to do a power grab when hes gotta deal with ~300 filibusters in Congress during his first term. The deficit isn't really his fault as much either, considering we are still funding wars overseas, and the economy hasn't rebounded yet, tension in the middle east(and NK) are at a high point which is hurting gas prices. Not only that any budget he tries to get passed that would help fix that, gets shot down by the House, only because the GOP doen't want to tax the wealthy.

    Romney won't be any better at least from my viewpoint. Since as we saw with Bush, he will still increase the size of the gov't, he won't be able to control the deficit, the economy will still be shit. However main difference with Romney is as hes already stated during his campaign, is that he will only really help out corporations and the wealthy and fuck over the lower class(cutting social benefits for example). He also seems more gungho about bombing the shit out of Iran, as most GOP seem to be, which is the last thing this country needs.

    Edit: Forgot to mention that I'm not on any welfare or social programs, though I'm what you would think of as lower middle class. However I do see the benefits of social programs and as a society I feel its right to look out for others who are in need.
    As a "right winger", I too see the benefits of welfare programs, believe it or not. What cheezes me off is the fact that they are so easy to abuse. I'm a single dad and I get no CS but I manage to make ends meet (when my truck isn't costing me 2 grand in repairs). I've survived being laid off for ten months followed by my son having AML. It's hard to do alone and I can understand how people who have tried to do everything right can still be in a fucked situation.

    What I have little sympathy for is someone who makes bad choice after bad choice because they've not been exposed to ANY consequence.


    I think the problem today is not the divide between the right and left; it's always been there. The main problem is nobody wants to compromise with each other. It's become a fucking football game where everyone is trying to win the championship rather the adults who understand compromise is what grown up people are supposed to do in order to resolve differences.

    Unfortunately, the voters are largely to blame. Personally, I think things will be better when all the baby boomers are dead (sorry Mom) so we can finally grow past the sixties.

  35. King Dong Fartman's Avatar
    Joined
    2007 Jan
    Location
    rock city
    Posts
    4,183
    R/P
    1.0475735118336
    Power
    20
    Quote Originally Posted by Rer View Post
    I don't know what Obama's plans are for his 2nd term
    wow someone's defensive! thanks for answering my question, though!

  36. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    A friend of mine is always posting these truly awesome, poignant and deeply meaningful editorial cartoons:

    Attachment 2791

    Ah, civil discourse.

  37. The Ethics of Madness Iratus's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    npc corp... yay?
    Posts
    1,539
    R/P
    0.40155945419103
    Power
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by poaw View Post
    It's not (aside from those sweet sweet campaign contributions), but you can't really complain about what your government did because another country asked them to when they had the option of not doing it. That problem falls squarely in the realm of YP instead of MP.
    Nevermind the fact that it's the US that voted those politicians into office. Is that my problem, too? If the rest of the world has to solve issues you created, at least you should be trying to create as little as possible, you know? I'll have to quote Zizek, here: "Everybody in the World, except US citizens should be allowed to vote and elect the American government".
    [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hChYV.png[/IMG]

    "Every rifter counts friend" - VR

  38. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    Nevermind the fact that it's the US that voted those politicians into office. Is that my problem, too? If the rest of the world has to solve issues you created, at least you should be trying to create as little as possible, you know? I'll have to quote Zizek, here: "Everybody in the World, except US citizens should be allowed to vote and elect the American government".
    I think this expects to much of "Democracy." Or maybe just the whole idea of "representative government" is so fucked that it's time to toss it, although God only knows what you could replace it with.

    Noone I've ever voted for has become President. Even my state representatives piss me off on a daily basis.

  39. The Ethics of Madness Iratus's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    npc corp... yay?
    Posts
    1,539
    R/P
    0.40155945419103
    Power
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by Raketefrau View Post
    I think this expects to much of "Democracy." Or maybe just the whole idea of "representative government" is so fucked that it's time to toss it, although God only knows what you could replace it with.

    Noone I've ever voted for has become President. Even my state representatives piss me off on a daily basis.
    Yeah, democracy may be the least worse system humanity has come up with so far, but it's a terrible one, at least at such a big scale. The problem about representative democracies is that people can't be trusted to properly decide about things that seem far and unimportant to them (foreign policy being a prime example: "let's attack Iran, the US can't seem weak", "it's your problem if my government orders stupid shit to yours!", "we need to intervene in Africa, this Kony guy is a meanie!").

    A democracy works when people can be directly screwed up by their votes (badly managed cities, local authorities screwing up and so on)... but when it comes to "national level" matters, things fall appart, and we get people voting for a president because he says he's a catholic just like them. As long as your average citizen can vote for people who can screw me, a citizen from another country half a continent away, things will be fucked up

    Also, I too am cursed with backin up candidates that don't get to office, but I guess it doesn't feel as bad given the somewhat functional multipartidist system we have here.
    [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hChYV.png[/IMG]

    "Every rifter counts friend" - VR

  40. Don't stop posting! Grath's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Aug
    Location
    PL
    Posts
    6,000
    R/P
    1.9306666666667
    Power
    27
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    If the rest of the world has to solve issues you created, at least you should be trying to create as little as possible, you know?
    Sure sure, some days you want our help, other days all the problems of the world are our fault. Unfortunately you don't get it both ways, and so I guess on days when you're wanting us to come deal with the local dictator who's making Europe's oil cost too much, you'll have to deal with the days when we want to fight a war against imaginary weapons of mass destruction.

  41. The Ethics of Madness Iratus's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    npc corp... yay?
    Posts
    1,539
    R/P
    0.40155945419103
    Power
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by Grath View Post
    Sure sure, some days you want our help, other days all the problems of the world are our fault. Unfortunately you don't get it both ways, and so I guess on days when you're wanting us to come deal with the local dictator who's making Europe's oil cost too much, you'll have to deal with the days when we want to fight a war against imaginary weapons of mass destruction.
    It's not "hey, help over here", but more "hey, plug your buttholes up there, it's raining diarrhea on the lower floors!"
    [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hChYV.png[/IMG]

    "Every rifter counts friend" - VR

  42. God is dead. They found his carcass in 2019.. Raketefrau's Avatar
    Joined
    2008 Sep
    Location
    Gimmelshtump
    Posts
    2,874
    R/P
    1.9558107167711
    Power
    16
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    It's not "hey, help over here", but more "hey, plug your buttholes up there, it's raining diarrhea on the lower floors!"
    So just develop a scat fetish. It's not like we didn't give you the internet to help.

  43. King Dong
    Joined
    2010 May
    Posts
    2,120
    R/P
    0.83396226415094
    Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    Nevermind the fact that it's the US that voted those politicians into office. Is that my problem, too? If the rest of the world has to solve issues you created, at least you should be trying to create as little as possible, you know? I'll have to quote Zizek, here: "Everybody in the World, except US citizens should be allowed to vote and elect the American government".
    I am almost certain that you have a national government somewhere in Columbia. They are the one's who decided that putting teenagers in jail for downloading "Pink Friday" was a worth it for a trade agreement with the US. I'm almost equally certain that few, if any, Americans voted those Colombian politicians into office. Therefore it remains your problem what your elected government does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    Yeah, democracy may be the least worse system humanity has come up with so far, but it's a terrible one, at least at such a big scale. The problem about representative democracies is that people can't be trusted to properly decide about things that seem far and unimportant to them (foreign policy being a prime example: "let's attack Iran, the US can't seem weak", "it's your problem if my government orders stupid shit to yours!", "we need to intervene in Africa, this Kony guy is a meanie!").
    You know, as long as a country doesn't have oil, it's pretty trivial to tell the US (and the rest of the western world) to fuck off. Whatever influence one country has on another outside of open warfare is because the country being influenced allows it to happen. Instead of complaining about the big mean yankees, you should be identifying the reasons the US has leverage in your country and working to eliminate them.

    Hell if you legalized the production of cocaine in your country and taxed it you'd probably end up as the #2 economy in North/South America overnight. As a fringe benefit you wouldn't need the US to give you shit and would be free to pursue a nuclear weapons program or put your flag on the Mars or build the Hanging Gardens or whatever.

    And the Kony thing wasn't even the US, the ICC decided he was the most wanted before some asshole put his face on youtube.

  44. Legitimate Rape Baby
    Joined
    2010 May
    Location
    Living the Hobo life
    Posts
    3,611
    R/P
    0.44696759900305
    Power
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Iratus View Post
    Nevermind the fact that it's the US that voted those politicians into office. Is that my problem, too? If the rest of the world has to solve issues you created, at least you should be trying to create as little as possible, you know? I'll have to quote Zizek, here: "Everybody in the World, except US citizens should be allowed to vote and elect the American government".
    That's retarded. The very fact we became a superpower was due to the rest of the world being all dumb and shit and having two world wars. Most of the wars we've been involved in we entered at someone elses behest.

    Much of the world is still fucked because of the problems left over from European imperialism. Keep blaming America for all your problems. It'll be true if you really wish hard enough.

  45. How to Build a Universe That Doesn't Fall Apart Two Days Later El Space Mariachi's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jan
    Location
    ebin pasta syndigate x---DDD
    Posts
    10,217
    R/P
    1.3839678966429
    Power
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by Manfred Hideous View Post
    That's retarded. The very fact we became a superpower was due to the rest of the world being all dumb and shit and having two world wars. Most of the wars we've been involved in we entered at someone elses behest.
    Let's have a look at some of the US' wars and how they came to take part in them!

    We'll discount the Wars from 1776-1812 since all of them were fought on American soil/against invaders

    Seminole Wars - The US directly started these with the intent of taking over Florida
    Mexican-American war - This one is a little more nuanced, but it still falls under "expansionism"

    <There's a litany of aggressive incursions made by US forces all around the world, solely to expand US interests, in the 1800s, too many to list>

    All those wars against the Indians to take their massive mineral wealth and reserves of land, which is a major factor in the US' success today

    The Spanish-American war (true, the President didn't want it, but it's a good example of American Intrusion in foreign affairs)

    Boxer Rebellion (all of the Western states that took part in these are equally as bad as each other when it comes to sticking their oar in where they're not wanted, though)

    A few more Mexican-American wars and conflicts throughout history

    The First World War, which the US entered in 1917, 3 years in, and only after a US liner had been sunk.
    The Second World War, which the US entered in 1941, 2 years in, and only after a pre-emptive strike by the Japanese

    We get some really good examples in the 20th century - Korea, Vietnam, Bay of Pigs, all those US-sponsored coups in far-flung countries, the funding of the Contras, Afghan Muhjahideen and other separatist/freedom fighter/terrorist groups, intervention in Somalia...

    Other than Libya, the First Gulf War and Kosovo, I can't think of any other wars that were joined for altruistic reasons such as preventing genocide or stopping a madman from bombing his own people/Kuwait, and even then, NATO overstepped the mark when it came to the no-fly zone (but that was mainly British and French planes that were carrying out bombing runs, although the US were still bombarding military targets that weren't attacking civilians. Tthe US actually did the right thing and led the diplomatic effort). The First Gulf War and Kosovo had pretty compelling reasons to fight in them, though (even if Desert Storm would conveniently open up Kuwaiti oil fields to US/UK/NATO businesses).

    The thing is, I'm not actually going to criticise most of those ; especially not the intervention in WWI and WWII - US citizens had died before the US joined WWI, and Japan made the first move in WWII (Nazi Germany even declared war on the US first, an enemy half the world away, that wasn't interested in fighting them) many were prudent and useful to a nation seeking to expand its influence, with only a few blunders (openly inciting war with the Vietnamese? The Domino effect is a retarded reason to go to war in some crappy little jungle country). It's just that arguing that the US takes part in wars usually for altruistic reasons doesn't pass muster when you look at all these wars they got involved in, or even caused, for selfish reasons.

    You should never view your country as some paragon of human civilization, traveling the world and meting out justice to those who oppose freedom - then you've been drinking the Tea Party's kool-aid and you're a fucking lunatic. The US performs altruistic actions all the time (US Aid contributions are pretty high), but it rarely goes to war for altruistic reasons - no country does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Manfred Hideous View Post
    Much of the world is still fucked because of the problems left over from European imperialism.
    This part is true though, especially in Africa and India. We're sorry about that!

  46. I'm Only in It for the Money Grim's Avatar
    Joined
    2010 Nov
    Location
    Pizza
    Posts
    3,715
    R/P
    0.39946164199192
    Power
    12
    I really think people need to stop blaming imperialism for the woes of the third world. If Europeans had never settled sub-saharan Africa it would still be a poor, backward, and violent place. Sure, the lines on the map would be different, but they wouldnt have even the bare bones infrastructure they have now.

    As to all those US wars from 1812-1917 shows we were people of our time. We were actually fairly constrained in terms of what other European powers were doing during that period.

    Korean War was us defending an Ally from being conquered by a terrible enemy (can you imagine if all of Korea was like North Korea). Also that was a UN action that included Brits, Aussies, French, Turks, etc.

    We entered Vietnam to fight communists after the French totally botched it, so blame them. It probably wasnt a neccesary war, but certainly wasnt a war of aggression on our part. We weren't going to gain anything even if we had won.


    Bay of Pigs was pretty stupid, but that was just us providing logistical support.

    And yeah, you kinda have a point with all our coups and stuff. But again, thats the way the world worked at that time. If we hadnt made them client states the soviets would have.
    If you kill enough of them they stop fighting - Gen. Curtis Lemay
    Fear the KKM

  47. How to Build a Universe That Doesn't Fall Apart Two Days Later El Space Mariachi's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jan
    Location
    ebin pasta syndigate x---DDD
    Posts
    10,217
    R/P
    1.3839678966429
    Power
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by Grim View Post
    -stuff-
    I was trying to avoid getting too deep into the reasons why the US got involved, and rather look at the fact that the US never gets involved in wars out of the goodness of its heart (and as I said, no country ever has and probably ever shall). The point about Korea is certainly salient, and it was a "good" war in that it actually got UN approval, and ended with a ceasefire and partition rather than one side imposing their government on all of the peninsula, and that if the US is guilty of what I criticised them over, the UK/NATO/The UN is too. However, the US openly incited the Vietnamese to attack by having one of their ships violate North Vietnamese territorial water, and ignore calls to leave. I'd call it a war of aggression solely for that, but I understand that it could be seen as protecting people who don't want communism from communism (communism is kind of shitty).

    When I say the US doesn't join wars out of its own kindness, It's not a criticism - every country in the world looks to their own interests first, and understandably so. I'm just pointing out that Manfred's point doesn't hold up.

  48. Big slab'a Prussian wurst Malaclypse's Avatar
    Joined
    2009 Jun
    Location
    In the Shadow of the Valley of Posting
    Posts
    4,985
    R/P
    0.86499498495486
    Blog Entries
    1
    Power
    18
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Peyote View Post
    Boxer Rebellion (all of the Western states that took part in these are equally as bad as each other when it comes to sticking their oar in where they're not wanted, though)
    Frankly, the Opiate trafficking the British Empire did to get a grip of China does have it's own kind of quality. Which of course doesn't mean that the other European countries weren't welcoming a weakening Chinese Empire to gain influence in the area themselves.

    [...] the First Gulf War [...] stopping a madman from bombing his own people/Kuwait [...]
    Wasn't that the 2nd with the first one being the Iran-Iraq war during the 80s?
    Monkeys killing monkeys killing monkeys over places of the ground.
    Silly monkeys, give them thumbs, they make a club and beat their brothers down.

    The universe is hostile, so impersonal: Devour to survive - So it is, so it's always been!

  49. How to Build a Universe That Doesn't Fall Apart Two Days Later El Space Mariachi's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Jan
    Location
    ebin pasta syndigate x---DDD
    Posts
    10,217
    R/P
    1.3839678966429
    Power
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by Malaclypse View Post
    Frankly, the Opiate trafficing the British Empire did to get a grip of China does have it's own kind of quality. Which of course doesn't mean that the other European countries weren't welcoming a weakening Chinese Empire to gain influence in the area themselves.



    Wasn't that the 2nd with the first one being the Iran-Iraq war during the 80s?
    I've always called that/seen it called the Iran-Iraq war vOv

  50. Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex Bill Schwartzski's Avatar
    Joined
    2011 Oct
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    341
    R/P
    1.0351906158358
    Power
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Manfred Hideous View Post
    As a "right winger", I too see the benefits of welfare programs, believe it or not. What cheezes me off is the fact that they are so easy to abuse. I'm a single dad and I get no CS but I manage to make ends meet (when my truck isn't costing me 2 grand in repairs). I've survived being laid off for ten months followed by my son having AML. It's hard to do alone and I can understand how people who have tried to do everything right can still be in a fucked situation.
    I agree with you on these points.

    Fucked up: Nadya Suleman getting welfare after doctors injected her with a bunch of fertilized eggs, with a history of mental illness (plastic surgery to look like Angelina Jolie) and no husband in sight. Now Californians are picking up her $2,000 food-stamp a month bill. I'm outraged at this shit, and I'm a liberal.

    Sad: That hard working dudes like yourself bust their ass to make ends meet and yet your paycheck is taxed to pay for people like Nadya Suleman.

    I don't want to give anyone the impression I'm one of those "government is the solution to every problem" guys - but when "right wing" people complain about welfare cheats, I can't disagree. However, the biggest welfare cheats on record currently are corporations like GE which, in 2011, payed zero corporate taxes. Which is seriously fucked up. Fuck Nadya Suleman and her clown car vagina, and fuck corporate tax laws allowing giant mega-international corporations a free ride.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •