When I was first playing this game, the first time I heard the command 'passive allign to <whatever>', I asked, what the fuck is a passive align? However, there seems to be a lot of people that believe a passive align means trying to align your ship to something at zero speed, which is kinda dumb to think that, because everyone that has played this game for more than an hour has already figured out that a zero speed align doesn't work.
The post I made in the Gents forums that has Kesper so up in arms, I sorry I can't reproduce here, as my forum access has been terminated. And please, if anyone from Gents would like to copy my post to here, please do so.
Anyway, my post went something along the lines of;
Why is there all this hate against passive aligning? What's wrong with having your fleet stay together, with everyone aligned to the warp out point, and near zero speed? Your fleet will stay together, and not get all strung out as it would with a full speed align. Your fleet will still enter warp faster than a fleet that is stationary, or has ships flying off in other directions, that would need to decelerate, and align before they could warp.
And yet, you are telling me that aligning to a point at full speed is ok, but having a fleet aligning to a point at only a couple of meters per second, is such a dangerous manoeuvre, that you will immediately get your fleet taken away from by Lake, as happened the other day.
Or, are you one one of these people, that when they here a command they don't know, instead of asking, just take a guess at what the command means, guess wrong, and then proceed to punish for people for doing said wrong thing you imagine they are doing. So tell me, do you really think a passive align is an extremely dangerous manoeuvre that is banned from being used by every FC in this alliance, or are you one of these dumb fucks that thinks a passive align means trying to align to something at zero speed because you were to proud, or ignorant to bother asking what exactly a passive align is?
It seems that posting the above on the Gents forums, was enough for the Gents lerderships to call for me to be tarred and feathered, along with Dan for his shenanigans.
What gets me is, Kesper and Lake are always going on about people participating on the Gents forums, 'never stop posting' is their catch-cry. And they they proceed to censor and/or delete any post they don't like. In fact, one of, if not the longest discussion thread on the forums, was about complaint from people about all the censorship that goes on.
And yet, as Kesper and Lake have both said, we, Ascendent, were an asset to them. And yet, no matter how good a corp is, make a post on the Gents forums insulting Lake, and you get insta kicked, no warnings, no chance to evac your stuff, just out. However, you can be the shittiest corp in the game. You can have spies, awoxers, thieves, anything, doesn't matter, provided you continue to suck Lake's dick, while he whips you with a stap.
Now, for those of you that don't know Lake already, and even perhaps are thinking of joining Gents, this is the sort of shit you will have to deal with;
(6:20:59 PM) dr_kang: hai gais! Soooooo, what's going on?
(6:22:03 PM) Kesper North <tally>: dr_kang: daniel decided to shitpost on kugu and leaked one of his posts from the leadership forum, and now he and marcus are chiming in badmouthing us in general.
(6:22:25 PM) Kesper North <tally>: they're also claiming that .UP. doesn't want to be in this alliance anyway. v0v
(6:22:30 PM) Kesper North <tally>: check out the GENTS thread and see for yourself
(6:23:30 PM) dr_kang: I was being
(6:23:32 PM) dr_kang: facetious
(6:23:37 PM) Kesper North <tally>: v0v
(6:23:45 PM) dr_kang: when have you not known me to know whats going on
(6:23:54 PM) Kesper North <tally>: When you're blackout drunk?
(6:23:59 PM) dr_kang: fair enough
(6:25:03 PM) dr_kang: because dan and lake have been pissing on each other's leg for a while, and Dan went public, we've been booted with no warning period at all, do I understand correctly?
(6:25:26 PM) Lake: dr_kang: I gave Dan what he wanted.
(6:25:33 PM) Kesper North <tally>: You've been temporarily removed from the alliance; this isn't 'booting'.
(6:25:36 PM) Lake: Up to UP to decide if it's what UP wants.
(6:25:47 PM) Kesper North <tally>: This is, in spirit, the same thing as temp-kicking a corp with an awoxer.
(6:25:59 PM) dr_kang: Yeh see, that's my issue.
(6:26:17 PM) Kesper North <tally>: As far as I'm concerned Dan is basically awoxing us, only he's generating posts instead of KMs.
(6:27:05 PM) dr_kang: Wow Kesper, I was hoping we'd reach an amenable solution to this steaming pile but if you equate mean words to awoxing Im not sure what can be done
(6:27:13 PM) Lake: o.O
(6:28:15 PM) Lake: You think this is about "mean words"?
(6:28:32 PM) dr_kang: What then? Insubordination?
(6:28:41 PM) Kesper North <tally>: It's not :words: It's the fact that he's been an ongoing problem, raising intensity with each try. He's spammed our forums. And he's actively trying to damage the alliance as a whole.
(6:29:00 PM) Lake: He made it clear he was trying to provoke something.
(6:29:04 PM) Lake: He succeeded.
(6:30:39 PM) dr_kang: Oh and first the yuri dos/script/spam thing. That I don't know what to say. If he was in fact running a spam script then he gets what he gets- I wasnt aware and certainly dont condone that shit
(6:31:49 PM) Lake: dr_kang: and dan not only condoned it, but both championed it and provoked it.
(6:32:20 PM) Kesper North <tally>:
Right. Part of why .UP. has been temporarily removed is that more than one person in UP is involved in this, and they seem to be egging eachother on.
(6:32:27 PM) Kesper North <tally>: We're trying to demonstrate that actions have consequences.
(6:36:01 PM) dr_kang: and you couldnt have come to me about this? The reason the apparent "fuck lake" post-off is going on was because the original comment was erased. Certainly I dont condone spamming, but the need to censor a negative comment seems to have given birth to this. And please spare me phrases like "actions have consequences".
(6:36:16 PM) Kesper North <tally>: dr_kang: you haven't been available in literally days
(6:36:18 PM) Lake: It wasn't censoring "a negative comment".
(6:36:30 PM) Lake: It was just my routine of clearing durpshit out of a thread.
(6:36:36 PM) Lake: Something I do at least once a week.
(6:37:31 PM) Lake: Then Dan picked it up as some sort of crusade...
(6:37:43 PM) dr_kang: I was away for three days. UP in general and shang all have my cell #. But let us not digress
(6:37:47 PM) Lake: I assumed he was just wasted so tempbanned him from the forums to stop the annoyance in the most practical way.
(6:38:15 PM) Lake: When I came back to EVE I found he'd taken his crusade to Kugu.
(6:38:22 PM) Lake: And that was that.
(6:39:26 PM) dr_kang:
I can abide the temp banning. And the constant spam is reason enough. I was also made aware of the situation last night, and had planned on speaking to the both of you..and this happened
(6:39:57 PM) Lake: You say "this" as if it's me who did "it".
(6:40:22 PM) dr_kang: the situation, chief
(6:42:26 PM) Lake: In hindsight it would appear that the durpdurp comment was as irrelevant as it initially seemed.
(6:42:44 PM) Lake: Dan seemed intent on provoking something, and does not seem to care what the "issue" is that he uses.
(6:43:23 PM) dr_kang: My issue is the way in fact, you handled it. There are how many corporations in this alliance, that are actually terrible-ones that have had repeated awoxers, spies, abyssmal particiaption and no-show leadership. These corporations get warnings and grace periods. UP, who has proven itself to be highly competent and has helped grow this alliance since the very early days, gets "temp banned" for what amounts to forum drama
(6:43:40 PM) Lake: No.
(6:43:45 PM) dr_kang: then explain it
(6:43:51 PM) dr_kang: as thats what it looks like over here
(6:43:54 PM) Lake: You were temp banned because you asked for it.
(6:44:16 PM) Lake: Dan attempted to provoke this, and succeeded.
(6:44:37 PM) Lake: I behaved exactly as he anticipated, and how everyone else should anticipate I would behave.
(6:45:09 PM) dr_kang: ...asked for it. Shit I better take off this cute dress before something bas happens
(6:45:14 PM) dr_kang: bad
(6:45:39 PM) Lake: dr_kang: Do you dispute that dan was explicitly provoking this?
(6:46:02 PM) Shangpo [email@example.com/ebba6374] entered the room.
(6:46:48 PM) dr_kang: I think he was frustrated and lashing out. Juvenile? Sure. So is booting the entire corp over something juvenile
(6:47:07 PM) Lake: If I could have booted only Dan, I would have.
(6:47:13 PM) Lake: But that option is not available to me.
(6:47:32 PM) Shangpo: o/
(6:48:22 PM) dr_kang: aaaaand you couldnt have said to us "you have 24 hours to remove dan"? Even corps with spies get that much.
(6:48:43 PM) Lake: That's what Kesper initially did.
(6:48:54 PM) Lake: I didn't have that much patience.
(6:49:03 PM) Lake: Harsh, yes, but I won't apologize for it.
(6:49:07 PM) dr_kang: yes we know
(6:49:30 PM) dr_kang: you do realize that it looks like you got your e-honor hurt and kicked us, right?
(6:49:56 PM) Lake: Look, let me be really clear here:
(6:50:07 PM) Lake: I have a very low tolerance for this sort of bullshit in my hobby.
(6:50:32 PM) Lake: I will kick every single corp from the alliance, and then kick every single member of PRAX, and then stop playing EVE entirely if that's the only way to avoid it.
(6:50:52 PM) Lake: The in-game political ramifications be damned.
(6:51:27 PM) Lake: So you can decide for yourself what you think is prudent, fair, and reasonable.
(6:52:04 PM) Lake: Everyone around me knows what to expect from me.
(6:52:31 PM) Lake: So I have little sympathy for those who complain when I do what is expected of me.
(6:52:58 PM) Lake: Okiedokie? =)
(6:53:10 PM) dr_kang: So if I know the dog is incontinent, and it shits on my rug, I shouldn't be mad at it?
(6:53:25 PM) Lake: Be mad all you like, but don't expect sympathy from your dog =p
(6:53:55 PM) Lake: Love the comparison though, real subtle.
(6:54:11 PM) dr_kang: thanks, I hear Im gud wif the wurds
(6:55:25 PM) dr_kang: youre justifying your actions by saying 'Im right, because you know Im going to react a certain way, and if you take umbridge its your fault, because you know how I am. Even if in fact, I am actually wrong, I am right, because you KNEW I would react wrongly and ecpected otherwise"
(6:55:39 PM) dr_kang: thats quite a psychological defense youve got there.
(6:55:43 PM) dr_kang: anyhoo
(6:55:51 PM) ***Lake smirks.
(6:58:11 PM) dr_kang: Ive tried Lake. I really have. I have taken endless shit at the hands of ppl I have flown with for years to stay in this alliance and make it grow, because no bullshit, I believed in our success. And to not even get the benefit of the doubt after all the work my corp and me personally have invested is problematic
(6:58:13 PM) Lake: Let us accept the premise that I 'acted wrongly' for a moment, and equate that to punching someone in the face. If you walk up to someone and do everything in your power to provoke them into punching you in the face, are you so shocked when you're punched in the face?
(6:58:52 PM) dr_kang: youre acting on the idea it was meant to provoke this particular response
(6:58:59 PM) Lake: Yes, I am.
(6:59:04 PM) Lake: That is what the evidence suggests to me.
(6:59:51 PM) Lake: And I have been giving you the benefit of the doubt.
(7:00:08 PM) Lake: But you guys crossed a line.
(7:00:10 PM) dr_kang: really? UP still looks booted to me
(7:00:42 PM) Lake: That you've been set blue, not had leadership access revoked, had forum access temp-instated despite the API, and we're having this conversations...
(7:00:47 PM) Lake: That doesn't seem like the benefit of the doubt?
(7:01:24 PM) Lake: Luke and Chris spent the whole morning chatting about this in Tally.
(7:01:34 PM) Lake: Dan and Marcus have taken to kugu.
(7:01:46 PM) Lake: I honestly don't know who speaks for UP
(7:02:34 PM) Lake: No one from UP stepped up to handle this situation.
(7:03:26 PM) Lake: Dan is the most senior member of UP that's been in contact through this episode.
(7:03:50 PM) Lake: Who am I to assume UP corp policy is anything but what he speaks?
(7:04:13 PM) Lake:
I'm not quite that naive mind...
(7:04:30 PM) Lake: ... but you can see how this is inextricable from UP as a corp.
(7:04:43 PM) dr_kang: Yeh well, here I am. I was at work. I was apprised of it and ran home. Here we are. The essential issue seems to be that you see what Dan wrote as a tripe dog dare to boot the WHOLE corp. I see it as some forum bullshit that got the corp as a whole booted
(7:04:45 PM) Lake: Dan's actions are UP's actions, and the consequences apply to UP.
(7:05:23 PM) Lake: You ran home when UP was removed.
(7:05:33 PM) Lake: You didn't comment in teh 24h+ previous.
(7:05:50 PM) Lake: Dan's little crusade didn't all just happen this morning.
(7:05:55 PM) Lake:
it came to a head this morning.
(7:06:10 PM) Lake: Luke and Chris ahve kept their heads down.
(7:06:22 PM) dr_kang: Because I told them to
(7:06:23 PM) Lake: Marcus' only input has been some equally shitty posting on the forums the night before.
(7:13:28 PM) Lake: Let me reiterate before we got too wrapped up in our sparring...
(7:13:34 PM) Lake: I *like* ascendent in general.
(7:13:42 PM) Lake:
You guys have obviously contributed hugely to the alliance.
(7:13:45 PM) dr_kang: What do you want me to tell you? Have I been on top of things for the las 3 days? No. RL multi-million dollar sale of a business>Eve. I know you understand. Last night I was apprised of the forum blurf. This morning at 7am EST I was filled in of the kicking...How is any of this relevant? Were out of the alliance for shit said on Kugu. Were not kicking Dan. I'm not going to convince you of any point but you're own. All I can ask is to re-accept us for say 72 hours to evac all our shit from CFC space. I think we've earned that much, and we have billions of assests, SCs included
(7:13:54 PM) dr_kang: was typing that out
(7:14:00 PM) dr_kang: before we get any further
(7:14:21 PM) dr_kang: and I would hate for my rank-and-file, who had NO idea any of this was coming
(7:14:24 PM) dr_kang: to get fucked
(7:15:26 PM) Lake: While I understand your predisposition to "defend one of your own", Dan's actions are indefensible, and while I have some sympathy for those who got caught up in this, their fate is up to you.
(7:15:53 PM) dr_kang: amazing
(7:16:33 PM) Lake: Actions have consequences my friend.
(7:16:39 PM) dr_kang: Just stop
(7:16:42 PM) dr_kang: seriosuly
(7:16:57 PM) Lake: You came in here saying we should have granted you 24h to remove Dan.
(7:17:07 PM) Lake: And yet you say you aren't removing Dan.
(7:17:08 PM) Lake: v0v
(7:17:24 PM) dr_kang: theres the principle of the issue, and practical action
(7:17:32 PM) Lake: Why should I do favors for those that are openly hostile to me?
(7:17:58 PM) Lake: Your corp leadership is busy posting up a storm of insults on kugu...
(7:18:58 PM) dr_kang: there is nothing I can say here Lake. Nothing. So you're right. Actions have consequences, and we all need to learn that.
(7:19:17 PM) Lake: It's a shame to lose the value you brought to the alliance.
(7:19:56 PM) Lake: But if it means I don't have to deal with a repeat of Dan's stunt, then it's worth it.
(7:20:10 PM) Lake: You may not agree with that, but it's a decision I made years ago.
(7:20:17 PM) dr_kang: Yeh well that's that. Like you said, actions have consequences.
(7:20:18 PM) Lake: I've long since learned to live with it.
(7:21:06 PM) dr_kang: We've dicussed your life choices at length Lake. As I've said its a beautiful construct you've made for yourself
(7:21:39 PM) Lake: We all have our delusions I suppose :smirk