NRDS sucks. thats all.
NRDS sucks. thats all.
How does it suck? if you don't like it. It means you have a lot of targets in the area. both pvp capable or carebears, take your pick according to your competance level. Or if you like it it means you have an area in which to do your thing without having to be on standby for CTA's. Honestly, whats not to like about it except that your too cool for NRDS and are jumping on a bandwagon.
I like the space police thing that CVA's ally Null does, like higher skilled PvPers who get intel from a region populated by softer blues
just dont like waiting for neutrals to shoot at me before I may shoot back.
Would also like to know more, the only one I can add something to is Cassiopeia as I'm quite sure they're soda renters so probably disband.Originally Posted by Ooohyoutouchmytralala
You guys are surely combat capable pilots who will probably thrive wherever you go. Say hi to gavin for me, and tell him he should FC some caldari/amarr FW fleets for old times sake
Anyone know what the other provi alliances plans are? Legio, Flying dangerous, Chaos Theory, Cassieopia, and the like? I assume many will just leave as soon as possible, but am curious about some of the more stubborn alliances intentions.
BDEAL, Agony and FIGL have ordered their members to move all non-essential stuff to empire, but are staying in providence for now. Internet Spaceships already mentioned on the previous page that Chaos theory is sticking it out as well. Not sure what the other alliances are going to do.
Edit: looking at the other alliances it seems that Teutonic Guard might be the next alliance to go: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/Teutonic_Guard
EVE fail pilot since 06.
Funnily enough, I was actually recommending that someone contact CVA and try to organize a joint operation to keep NC. out. I was guessing that both CVA and the Providence Coalition would rather deal with each other instead of NC./Ev0ke. It probably wouldn't have worked out, but it might have been fun to try.
Personally, I'd like to see more NRDS space in Providence. The whole "fight club" idea never appealed to me. Neighbors fighting with each other just weakens both sides and makes it easier for outsiders to crush one or both. These are my personal opinions, but LEGIO in general is not really a roaming alliance. We don't normally feel a need to go out and raid other people's space, trying to kill ratters and miners. Our PVP activities tend to be defensive in nature, either guarding our space or helping allies resist invasion.
As for LEGIO's plans, we don't intend to go anywhere.
You would fit great in the NC or FountainBloc
See how well that works out for ya (don't talk about fight club)
Teutonic guard is disbanding, cryo innovations is looking for other alliances atm.
Look, I think most of the NBSI enthusiasts in legio are gone. Once again, I can't speak officially for CVA, but has legio thought about approaching us and going NRDS? You were NRDS before after all. Most in CVA don't, but I still feel bad every time I kill a legio pilot : /
I've seen a lot of Agony guys in Litom (curse), I'd have thought they moved there. Same with Batphone (who was very briefly in Provi, at the same time as kadeshi) who seem to be living in Utopia (curse).
For all the GUYS GUYS MY E-HONOUR jokes we make, Goons are one of the biggest proponents for sticking up for our bros due to debts owed from back before most of the current guys had even started playing. We also still bear blood grudges against alliances for shit guys that have long quit did to slight us. Whereas some dudes feel their gameplay demands poking someone in the eye when five minutes ago they were shaking hands. It's the whole Internet Space BFFs thing, and while I'm not trying to be trite and this certainly isn't always 100% true it's been the defining difference between the cuddling carebears of the North and the slapfighting sperglords of the South. Provi has historically been a wizardhat-shaped island surrounded by a sea of those sperglords and I guess the tide's coming in.
You are correct about the NBSI enthusiasts no longer being with us. It's not something that we feel a need to approach CVA about as it's an internal matter, but our RoE policy is currently under discussion. This isn't any kind of secret, if we make a decision to change our policy we will announce it so that Providence residents and anyone interested in becoming one are aware of the change.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard...readID=1289924You were NRDS before after all. Most in CVA don't, but I still feel bad every time I kill a legio pilot
It is... omg shocking... to see Legio trying to swap sides again when the fire gets heavy. Shock. Ing.
Everyone makes mistakes, there is no need to point fingers and accusations when redemption and forgiveness are much more satisfying. Also, I doubt anyone in legio really expects CVA to ever be blue or even neutral again, and they are not swapping sides. Sounds to me like they are mearly switching back to their preferred rules of engagement, if they do indeed go back to nrds. Why would any NRDS enthusiast be sad to see another NRDS entity in the game? Even Electus matari should be pleased, as, far as I know, legio did renounce slavery and have not gone back on that.
There has always, in my opinion, been respect between TRUE NRDS entities, even if they are of opposing beliefs. There are simply too few of us to point fingers, so we should rejoice everytime another slice of eve, no matter how small, goes to the civilized way of doing things.
Sorry for the :lolrp: post
I've always preferred NRDS to NBSI, no change there.
http://www.eve-search.com/thread/1282331/page/6#160
http://www.eve-search.com/thread/1261821/page/3#68
This has worked out for many Goon allies in the past.
(Most of them died because it isn't true you see).
The only reason Legio is talking about going back to NRDS is because they think they can get back into CVA good graces by doing it. Legio still has the same leader, the same one that made the thread I linked where he proudly announced they are going NBSI. When CVA tells them to take a hike, they'll either stay NBSI or failcascade.Why would any NRDS enthusiast be sad to see another NRDS entity in the game?
Better for NRDS groups that alliances like Legio be cannibalized and failcascade so that if there are any legit NRDS pilots in the alliance, they go to proper and true NRDS groups that are committed to the RoE and don't flip sides as soon as the ships start poppin'. No legitimate self-respecting NRDS alliance would ever have gone NBSI and blue'd up Ushra'Khan. Legio is awful and deserves a mercy bullet to the dome.
I don't understand the concept of people dismissing slights and bad deeds that someone has done to you in this game.I don't understand the concept of people dismissing favors and good deeds that someone has done to you in this game.
Hey man I didn't say we were effective at it
I still feel bad about UNL
If we go NRDS, it will be because we want to. It's not for CVA's benefit, and I imagine that we will remain on each other's red list as long as LEGIO continues to hold sovereignty in Providence regardless of our rules of engagement concerning neutrals. Yes, our leader has remained the same. The NBSI enthusiasts being referred to before were members of his council of leaders and advisors, and they are no longer with us.
I'm going to have to disagree with your opinions here, as well as your assertions. UNITY was technically NRDS themselves at the time, even if they did have some warzone exceptions I wasn't a fan of. As for "as soon as the ships start popping", where have you been for the past year? The ships haven't stopped popping, and I don't expect them to.Better for NRDS groups that alliances like Legio be cannibalized and failcascade so that if there are any legit NRDS pilots in the alliance, they go to proper and true NRDS groups that are committed to the RoE and don't flip sides as soon as the ships start poppin'. No legitimate self-respecting NRDS alliance would ever have gone NBSI and blue'd up Ushra'Khan. Legio is awful and deserves a mercy bullet to the dome.
U'K hasn't been NRDS in many years now. All they have done is shoot at NRDS alliances for the past three years, and not just for RP reasons, you can see by their actions in G-W currently that they are an NBSI alliance.
For the most part, your carebear party in 6-0 has been uninterrupted save a few cloaky ships here and there. Now you have a sov threat on your doorstep that can squash you in US TZ and your allies, the only thing that saved your space from CVA to begin with, are leaving the area. A far different situation than prior, hence why people like you from Legio are on here talking about going NRDS, a last desperate fail-plan to try to obtain CVA as an ally.As for "as soon as the ships start popping", where have you been for the past year? The ships haven't stopped popping, and I don't expect them to.
Precisely.Yes, our leader has remained the same.
Hand I would have to argue against that statement, there was a fairly constant CVA presence in the main part of LEGIO space for several months that didn't let up until systems started dropping sov and our attention went elsewhere. From our prospective based on when our campaign started there was a clear drop in Legio membership and activity up to s9x becoming CVA sov. At that point CVA focus drifted elsewhere and the consistent activity against LEGIO ceased. In fact its fairly safe to say LEGIO probably saw MORE CVA interference than any other NIP group with the possible exception of Flying Dangerous who saw interference simply due to the fact of the proximity of N8 to Misaba.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
[ 2010.10.10 04:06:20 ] Easley Thames > GUYS DO NOT SHOOT CVA --- FOLLOW PRIMARIES
[ 2010.10.10 04:06:26 ] Easley Thames > (never thought i'd say that)
http://myanimelist.net/profile/rovern88
http://providenceregion.blogspot.com/
Well, they chose to stick it out in the East and then silently crumble away. Don't feel guilty! (In hindsight, all the entities that declined living in Goon-Querious you'd think the palce has AIDS or something.)Hey man I didn't say we were effective at it
I still feel bad about UNL
The facts have a strong anti-A- bias.
Would never happen.
LEGIO turned its back on CVA when going got tough, and that's not something aralis looks kindly on. I was talking with him a few weeks back and the subject came up about what would happen if the old holder alliances that bailed came back, and basically his response was "they can all go burn in hell".
All NRDS alliances are automatically super-huggy-best-friends-4ever?
U'K seems to have a more flexible mixture of RoEs though, I can see how that makes some people bitter and rage.
No bitter and rage about it, they're just not NRDS. It's a long-standing U'K troll. They're NBSI and they exclusively partner with NBSI groups. They might be NRDS in Jove space, but I haven't made it out that far yet to check it.
And yes, actual NRDS alliances and corps should actually TRY to get along, considering that we're outnumbered by 99% of eve's population.
Carebear tearsWhat the fuck does being NRDS got to do with who you're friends with and who your enemies are? It's just a RoE. A whole bunch of NRDS groups are wizardhats who are bitter enemies with each other.
For example: CVA and provipals / -EM-, -SF- etc.
Legio where never a holder alliance of CVA, just some guys who lived in providence under CVA's protection.
Theres a difference between the two..
To qoute Aralis : I may well have said that about Legio I've certainly not said any of the old Holders can burn in hell! I wish them well and would welcome them back.
To clarify: the context of the discussion was the people who left and joined the -A- bandwagon. Not specifically the ones who went to NC. However I am not sure why any of those would ever come back. The north is every carebears dream...
LEGIO didn't just leave the space nor changed sides. Under the pressure from UK LEGIO went to RP forum and announced that they are renouncing CVA and its slaver activities. Every non-holder in provi got that threat from UK "renounce CVA and make a post in RPforum or be perma decced", most of them didn't take them seriously since UK usually camped hubs and pipes to kill wts. that annoucement is not a big deal to me or to most ppl in eve but to a RP alliance it is a big deal.
as for UK they don't have a flexible NRDS policy. They go NBSI wherever they are living and fighting and rest is NRDS. technically UK is NRDS in tenal but you don't see them there so who cares. SF and EM are both viable NRDS groups. we can all make fun of Jade but SF is strict on their NRDS policy. Both groups don't enforce their policy on their allies but they do follow it everywhere in eve!
Actually they're NBSI in Tenal and all other nullsec.
I believe they're NRDS in Minmatar part of the matar-amarr FW space which occasionally matters :derp:
I wasn't part of LEGIO leadership at the time, but I do know the situation was a little more complicated than that. I do know that we weren't hearing anything from CVA at the time, and the general feeling was that CVA was not even trying to defend Providence. I'm sure this is something you've all heard before. I believed then and I believe now that it didn't matter what LEGIO did, CVA was going to get pushed out of Providence. Our leader accepted the deal to get some space in the aftermath. I didn't like it at the time, but he was trying to do what was best for his people. Also, it really didn't make the situation any worse for CVA.
This is not an apology, and I don't expect this explanation to give CVA any warm fuzzy feelings. I just wanted to explain my point of view from within LEGIO to try and give everyone a better view of the issue. It was a big issue for me personally at the time and I almost left LEGIO over the way it was handled, especially since some of the aforementioned NBSI enthusiasts took advantage of the situation to basically go pirate. Even so, I'm glad I decided to stick with LEGIO. It's been a fun and interesting year.
AKA: "When the going got tough, we flipped sides to the winning team. Now the going is getting tough, who will take us?"I believed then and I believe now that it didn't matter what LEGIO did, CVA was going to get pushed out of Providence. Our leader accepted the deal to get some space in the aftermath.
Never's a long time. Certainly any agreement would of course take into account that Legio switched to the "winning" side when the going got tough and are now seeking another way out when the going got tough again. Trust wouldn't be instant and reprieve would not be free.
However, CVA does not conduct diplomacy on public forums, and we certainly don't conduct diplomacy through third parties speaking on our behalf. It has been a great frustration of mine to observe "CVA said" statements when maybe "CVA" never "said" that, maybe it was an ally of CVA who felt obliged to speak up for us.
Not sure if this is the right thread for RoE discussions, but I guess a mod can split it out if it derails too much ...
From what I gather, and ignoring the "they say X but do Y" stuff, there's three general types of NRDS:
1) The alliance defines the red list and sets others to red if they shoot people who are not on that list. (CVA)
2) The alliance has a red list and sets others to red if they shoot people not on that list, but allows other corps/alliances to have their own reds and blues as long as they don't "overdo" the redding. (EM, TRUE, RE-AL)
3) The alliance maintains their own red list and does not care what other alliances do. Groups get set to red for shooting the alliance, but for nothing else. (U'K, SF)
Some of this is area-dependent. For example, all of CVA, EM, TRUE and RE-AL do their various degrees of "enforcing" standings only for specific areas (CVA for Providence, "lower" Domain and Derelik; EM for Heimatar, Metropolis, Molden Heath and Great Wildlands; RE-AL for Great Wildlands; not sure about TRUE).
Some of these entities have different RoEs depending on where they are (U'K, mostly; I think all others are NRDS everywhere).
U'k doesn't fall into same category as SF. U'K is NRDS in name only, SF have their own list and they usually send mail if they are making an alliance red. U'K simply goes into the region and blues all the strong ppl and declares that said region will be battle ground and they will be NBSI. For too long U'K said they are NBSI in providence/catch/curse and NRDS everywhere else but they don't operate anywhere else. Like i said eariler we can all hate Jade for being Jade but he does NRDS correctly.
You really sounds mad, where did LEGIO touch you?
Or where didn't they touch you?
Dara Cothrom lost a 100 man corp recently and have started dropping sov. Bye fags o/
Re-Al is NRDS everywhere. And so is (to my knowledge) TRUE.
We call it SRSI (Set Red Shoot It) which is a little more proactive than "passive NRDS". Meaning: Neuts aren't shot at but eyed warily.
U'K, RoE aside, proved themselves time and again as untrustworthy drama queens in cloaky Vagas. I can't understand the fuzz about them. I hope -V- and VOLT are enjoying their allies "help".
VOLT seems to have left GW for Stain, and Ushra'Khan went on a campaign against the Amarr Militia, so it seems GW is quieting down a lot. I think -V- has no big allies anymore down there, with the largest recurring fleet supporter being Thukker Tribe Mercenaries?
Back to Providence - DACO have recently transferred all the outpost sov from one of their holding corps, DARA HOLDINGS, to another of their holding corps, Phoenix Industries and Logistics. They also dropped sov in all of their non-outpost systems. Might mean that they're transferring sov to another alliance and leaving the area, as a friendly poster above noted.
That, together with Teutonic Guard cascading and AGONY moving to Curse, cost the NIP about 20% of their members.
Providence NIP (2541)
- Important Internet Spaceship League <BDEAL> (891)
- Flying Dangerous <FIGL> (874)
- Imperial 0rder <I0> (315)
- Chaos Theory Alliance <CHAOT> (245)
- LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM <LEGIO> (216)
CVA Block (1954)
- Curatores Veritatis Alliance <CVA> (868)
Holders - http://www.cva-eve.org/index.php?page=holders
- Care Factor <C.F> (373)
- Apocalypse Now. <APOC> (297)
- TSOE Consortium <TSOEC> (128)
- Aegis Militia <AM> (107)
Other allies
- Nihilists Social Club <NULL> (181)
Ev0ke Coalition (1184)
- Ev0ke <EV0KE> (1184)
- Northern Coalition. <NC> (807)
- Ewoks <EWOKS> (708)
I'm happy to hear about groups I forgot or I erraneously added :-)
The member numbers are given only to give a rough idea about the relative importance; member numbers don't matter much unless they're off by a few factors. E.g. when we hear about LEGIO (216) possibly leaving, it'll likely be less of a blow than e.g. BDEAL (891) leaving. How much less is difficult to say. Certainly not 4.125 times less of a blow. So don't give too much about the exact numbers.
Why the hell did Wretched. leave NC. anyway?
The paper numbers understandably don't tell the whole story.
At the battle for JEIV-E, Evoke & Ewoks fielded about 180 to the NIP's 200 in US prime time, so the effective numbers favor Evoke quite strongly now that Diasho, Soda and Agony have left the building.
But what allows Evoke to really punch above it's weight is the number of Guardians and Super-carriers it can deploy.
I don't know anything really about Circle of Two, but their return to the region may change things again.
Imperial Order got reset by the other providence alliances for not being around when needed. As for DACO they're currently in the progress of pulling their operations in providence, although they haven't figured out where they will go next from what I've heard.
Evoke meanwhile seems to be focusing on securing Daisho and Solus space, but what they're going to do next is still in the air.
The big wild card right now seems to be Co2
EVE fail pilot since 06.
Make me a third-party CVA diplomat I will diplomacy the fuck out of everybody in Providence
i posted this in the other thread, it come down the pipe yesterday that an option on the table is for co2 to pull out from provi and go to stain to guerilla -A-.
Gargle Blaster I believe mazz saved your ass from being booted from co2 the other day.
but no one knows my true identity!!!!!1
it will be official soon but co2 is failcascading
half are moving back to venal? according to someone in the politics thread anyway.
Random NC. aeon was hitting one of my corps reaction pos's yesterday. Thankfully it seems he was just waiting for an op =)
A quick update:
-Ev0ke has taken 12 systems (10 with stations) in Provi, most notably the six pack
-Ewoks have taken 4 systems (1 with station), all of which are buffered by Ev0ke owned systems
-Someone has closed down the NIP's (or what's left of its) intel channel, leaving every alliance to fend for themselves
-Co2 and Agony have been reset by some of the remaining NIP
-NC. currently has their cap fleet in lower Provi, right now they're bashing a POS in 08z
That's all I've got for the time being.
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