Challenge!
Here are a couple of random statements you have made recently, liquid. I am still waiting on the proof of them:
1. BoB doesnt post losses
2. BoB hides losses when "they get their ass handed to them" (where and when did they lose a major fleet battle)
3. The coalition killed a baby titan in F-T
Three quickies. Proof please. Liquid I wont let it go until you can show me where this taking place. You said it, back it up.
You sure you didn't hit the wrong button?
[i]Leaving the game? Send your stuffz to "Other Ideas", preferably with a very long contract[/i] - :v: [SIZE="4"]? ? ?[/SIZE]
Quote: urfunny Bit strange that the plex did not drop anything, not even effects or bounties since they were broken even since they were placed, other that the 3 days that RA did them?
Proof?
Originally Posted by BOBISCAUGHT
Can you point me where I said that? I dont plex, so really wouldnt know. Unfortunately, us empire people dont have the means to those plexes. If I posted that I must have been drunk.
BoD makes up kills also, the number of ships killed in a system and the number that are posted dont match at all.
Oh and once you prove you are not DC, then your questions will get answered
Sigh, you are really not a very smart person if you post crap like this. I guess that the person the other day who received a KILLMAIL as an agent offer made that up to. The game is completely messed up when it comes to stuff like that. If you are going to post stuff like this I will have to ask you where the proof is. I guess since you are obviously someone they have picked on you have plenty of evidence showing this to be true. Please post it.
A standard BoD responce, lol
Well if the systems shows less losses, the people supposedly dieing have less losses, and some of the ships posted cant be flown by the pilots who were killed in them. Then it MUST be the game because BoD would NEVER cheat.... oh wait... oh well
by the way DC, I got a mail from Mollie to come "try out" I laughed and laughed
see ya DC
Typical coalition response. "I cant prove ANYTHING but I WANT IT TO BE TRUE SO BAD SO IT MUST BE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" One killmail please? Just one? Please?
As for the DC comments, I thought I was some no name BoB guy and now I am back to DC. Guess it is good to move up to at least not be a no name.
Ok lets investigate the alligations
1. Bob dont post losses -
Hmm - Accorting to coalation killboards - every bob they killed is in the bob killboard - So I cannot see bob not posting any losses. Acctually - Somebody posted that shrike died in a titan, but there was no shrike lossmail on the bob killboard. But shike still flys the titan so that was a coalation posting a fake killmail.
So link a kill otherwise it does not count. Arguining otherwise without proof means your are not to be taken seriously.
2. Bob post fake kills
This alligation is that somebody said - bob posted more killmails that were in the system. Except that this was said by a random person with no backup evidence. Now this one is easy to check. Surely someone can link a bob killmail of themselves or their corpmates that is a fake?
So link a kill otherwise it does not count. Arguining otherwise without proof means your are not to be taken seriously.
Thats it folks - Bob's killboard is looked at VERY closely by every alliance and the top merc corps in the game - A single bob fake killmail will be spotted instantly! There are people desperate to find one instance. Find just one fake and BOOM every one will jump them.
At the moment all non-colation and non-bob+freinds regard bob's killboard for the past few years as being the most accurate one around.
Found it. EVE3007 or whatever posted that. Apology accepted.
Apologies sent personally to you!Found it. EVE3007 or whatever posted that. Apology accepted.
But since you ARE BOTH ON THE SAME TAG TEAM....
they didnt post a carrier loss until the guys started whining about it to them
it appeared on the bob killboard and then dissapeared again.
they also kill and post all abandoned shuttles they can find just to up their numbers and points on killboards.
Link please. Should not be hard. Which guys started whining about it? Who was "Them".
Dont Shuttles, Noobships and capsules get filtered from bob killboard? I never seen one in the front screen, could be me though.
D2 automaticly suck up the kills posted on other peopels killboards..
So all the fake killmails on other boards will automaticly pop up on theres too. *shrugs*
liquid? i think his name is? does a good job of TRYING to get killmails from other boards, but the d2 killboard still misses somewhere in the range of 1/5 of their deaths.
What you mean a request for SOME semblance of proof to go with your baseless accusations? Damn you BOB no fair this is internet spaceships where proof is not neccessary!
Proof or stfuWell if the systems shows less losses, the people supposedly dieing have less losses, and some of the ships posted cant be flown by the pilots who were killed in them. Then it MUST be the game because BoD would NEVER cheat.... oh wait... oh well
You are getting beyond lame.
I heard they also kill pods to pump their stats. ONOES
Yeah, you have a point. I have done that lots of times too so no worries. As for the apology, I was simply being a smart ass.Apologies sent personally to you!
But since you ARE BOTH ON THE SAME TAG TEAM....
I dont have inside knowledge of how it works but do know that there have been MANY instances where people have made these type claims on EVEO and the BoB leadership has said over and over to point them out and the pilot will be dealt with harshly. Hence the reason that many consider this the most accurate killboard.
i think bob just wait 24 hours or so for the kills to show up or get posted. because ive never seen truly missing kills, just delayed kills.
:v: [b]. . . . . . . [/b]
~~~~
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Man, this u call challenge? Piece of cake!
Testimony of previous BOD rivals + intelligence sources.
- 3 different and even contradicting statements of BOD leadership (MS at 30/3, Titan at 1/4, Emty pos at 2/4 )
- strange delay of BOD leadership final statement(3 days!).
- Previous well known Lies of Bod leaders
- strong support from our Intelligence sources.
- Testimonies from pilots, who participated in the fight.
- Even BOD members know the truth. U can read DBP's morale blog, revealed by Kug on this site.
AND NOW! My dear friend, the REAL challenge!
What real proof do u have on so called BOD 'victory'?
And when I say real I mean, except rigged kill boards, fake screenshots and deceitful statements of BOD members / pets.
Cyvok? Those people are bitter and never posted a SINGLE killmail, other than one pod one time on EVE O that I saw. Please get off of this. BoB doesnt fake anything nor do they not post their losses. You cant seriously believe that in a game of 100k plus accounts not ONE of those people could ever produce proof? You are wrong here so give it up. If you can find one fake killmail or one that is not posted I would be impressed, but if you cant please dont count "he said, she said" as proof.
There was what is widely considered to be a april fools joke on 4/1 saying it was a titan. BoB/Evil Thug both posted screenshots of two ship yards, one with a build, the other without. After the POS was shot down, there was one ship yard...still building. Get it?- 3 different and even contradicting statements of BOD leadership (MS at 30/3, Titan at 1/4, Emty pos at 2/4 )
- strange delay of BOD leadership final statement(3 days!).
- Previous well known Lies of Bod leaders
- strong support from our Intelligence sources.
- Testimonies from pilots, who participated in the fight.
- Even BOD members know the truth. U can read DBP's morale blog, revealed by Kug on this site.
Lies of BoB leaders? Where?
Delayed statement? I think if I had a MS building I would love for the coalition to think they had killed whatever was building so they didnt reinforce the other POS.
Intelligence sources? The same intelligence that an IRON member said last night was flawed and that the North blamed the goons for crappy intelligence gathering. Anyone remember the "If LV had a titan we would know it." followed by BOOM 212 kills.
BoB members knew? The one I talk to alot told me BEFORE it happened that they were baiting them. Immediately after it happened he made the comment that the POS was empty. Weird. I thought bob members knew it? That is what you gathered from the morale blog? I read that to mean, stop listening to the coalition lies on EVEO. We know we havent let you respond, but dont worry about thing. Dunno, maybe BoB is falling apart.
So basically I am limited to "he said, she said" like you get your information. Lets not point to the killboards of the coalition to see they are losing. Lets not point to the fact that BoB has killed over 1k BS in the last month which can be counted on coalition boards. Lets not count the fact that BoB kicked RZR out of 9CG. Lets not count the R97 station or C3- or the rest of Feyth that the coalition was hanging their hats on. Lets not count the loss of D2 outposts. Lets not count the MS being launched on FRAPS (not screenshot). Where exactly are you winning against BoB? I know you want to rest on the fact that you beat up LV, but see, that doesnt count. You guys said you would be in Delve in a month. Three months later and where are you? Losing anything you had taken. Any questions or arguments about that?AND NOW! My dear friend, the REAL challenge!
What real proof do u have on so called BOD 'victory'?
And when I say real I mean, except rigged kill boards, fake screenshots and deceitful statements of BOD members / pets.
BTW...here is another challenge for "killboards are FAKE!!!":
olzi
dash ripton
Poliy Armi
Iraf Thaiberd
Sesfan Qu'lah
CowWarrior
Walumachoncha SA
Ketanga
MGargantua
jihan
Zataaki
Kai Wooglin
Stalax
Dark Renegade
sigma14
VIPERKILLER
Those are the last 16 BS kills on BoB's board. According to you they fake killmails so surely out of all the those BS kills one is fake. Please have them refute one on EveO. Please? There was lots of kills in ECP8 today. Surely there are some killmails not posted from those fights. Surely?
The problem is that its not only Cyvok and ASCN, but other corporations and alliances as well. + Intelligence data from various sources in BOD and pets.
I think that main purpose of ppl who play Eve is to enjoy the game, and not large scale detailed investigation of BOD.You cant seriously believe that in a game of 100k plus accounts not ONE of those people could ever produce proof? but if you cant please dont count "he said, she said" as proof.
Screenshots fake, it was a part of the 2 leaders 1st april joke.There was what is widely considered to be a april fools joke on 4/1 saying it was a titan. BoB/Evil Thug both posted screenshots of two ship yards, one with a build, the other without.
I see. But with all my respect, this doesn't contradict version of titan in destroyed pos.After the POS was shot down, there was one ship yard...still building. Get it?
BTW BOD didn't want to let this pos go down, they tried very hard to repair it. Why it was so important for them? so important that they risked men and ships in attempt to repair the pos under fire?
There is no strong evidence (except "he said, she said") that the second pos wasn't building, and even if so, production could be cancelled, delayed, finished etc.
sounds resonable to me, BUT why to say on 30/3 that coalition destroyed MS inside the pos? They could say nothing or something like 'we can't aprove or deny'. And here we come to the 2 choices:Lies of BoB leaders? Where?
Delayed statement? I think if I had a MS building I would love for the coalition to think they had killed whatever was building so they didnt reinforce the other POS.
1. Either the pos wasn't empty. (something was there - titan/MS)
2.Or the pos was empty, but BOD leadership lied about mothership inside destroyed pos.
First of all, it was well known to the coalition ppl that chowdown has a titan. Infant titan destroyed in JV1V was meant to be LV's second.Intelligence sources? The same intelligence that an IRON member said last night was flawed and that the North blamed the goons for crappy intelligence gathering. Anyone remember the "If LV had a titan we would know it." followed by BOOM 212 kills.
And 1 failure, which btw may be not because of intelligence but due to problems in communication/analysis of situation/etc, doesn't mean the whole intel structure fucked up. So far I have no reasons to doubt it.
again not a real proofBoB members knew? The one I talk to alot told me BEFORE it happened that they were baiting them. Immediately after it happened he made the comment that the POS was empty.
no commentWeird. I thought bob members knew it? Dunno, maybe BoB is falling apart.
So basically the whole thread is quite pointlessSo basically I am limited to "he said, she said" like you .
We r not loosing. Current state is draw between parties.Where exactly are you winning against BoB?
In some battles Bod win, in some Coalition win, but the summery - 0 points to both teams.
Its not only LV, but FATAL, ISS, Gunboat diplomacy, chorus of dawn.I know you want to rest on the fact that you beat up LV,
Common, BOD said also many stuff which turned to be BullShit afterwards. Like 'Coalition is dead but they don't know it yet', 'Coalition is second ASCN', 'We will finish them all in 1 month', etc.but see, that doesnt count. You guys said you would be in Delve in a month. Three months later and where are you? Losing anything you had taken. Any questions or arguments about that?
Honestly, I don't understand BOD's obsession with BS. Once when BS was the largest and the most expensive ship it was an important criterion for fleet battles. But today, when we have HACS, Capitals, Command ships which r much more expensive and uber then BS, it looks very odd.Those are the last 16 BS kills on BoB's board. According to you they fake killmails so surely out of all the those BS kills one is fake. Please have them refute one on EveO. Please? There was lots of kills in ECP8 today. Surely there are some killmails not posted from those fights. Surely?
Secondly when they say we killed x BS it doesn't mean coalition lost x BS. Cause they count neutral BS as well.
Thirdly if u devide losses of BS per each hostile to BOD allaince u see, that they r not critical.
At last, if the ratio is on their favor, unnecessary (but yes they still can though) they would rig kb on that particular day.
The reason why everybody knew there was a LV titan in J1V1 was because Screenshot proof of build queue before the event. So everybody knew weeks in advance, and even pictures of the build queue was used in peoples sigs! There was no doubt because there was a screenshot showing the titan build time in advance, and another after showing no build queue.
The problem with the Bob one is that it is all been baised on hearsay. Nobody has put in proof that anything was ever being built in there, its all been baised on a "CYVOK" or a "Tony Blair". I.e hearsays that sounds good to beguin with, but turns out to be completly wrong.
So common sense dictates that the wrong pos was hit. But here is the better way of solving this once and for all. Why not let the Coalation leaders make Official Statement to say there was a Titan in the pos?
What is important here, that screenshot wasn't fake and LV admitted the loss. Which is certainly not the case in F-T.
Not at all. If u interested, u can read explanations in my first comment, in this thread.
Why? Ppl in Bod wouldn't believe. Ppl inside the coalition already know.
I hate to disappoint you, but the people in the coalition dont already know it. In fact, I would venture a guess that more believe it was a mistake than believe it was a titan.
I'm not a BoB fan at all, I can't stand their arrogance, it's become a lot more bearable now that they barely post on EvE-O anymore though.
But the 'omg bob cheats haxz0rz' has, I believe, been taken way out of proportions. It's lost any and all of it's strength and credibility because at every event people go 'omgwtf! they cheat!'.
They did cheat, and any statements they made before claiming they weren't cheating were simply lies.
But let's face it, even though us from the antibobmob may not like it, but the main reason BoB is where they are now, and why they still are there despite being outnumbered greatly in this war, is not because they cheated, it's because they've shown to be an excellent military and logistics force. When the attack started they defended against D2 in fountain, Iron/Rzr/MM in querious and AAA in Period Basis. All at the same time. Save maybe for MC none of the BoB space residents, or 'pets' if you wish, would be able to withstand an attack by a coalition entity on their own. And yet BoB has hardly lost any territory.
From replies in this thread it seems fairly obvious that their killmails aren't faked, and why should they? I've fought them in fleet battles and they simply are very good. I'm affraid their killdeath ratio, or whatever it is they're judged by, is simply because they are very good at what they do, not because they make up shit.
They are by no means invincible; the coalition has plenty capable FC's to win fleet battles, and the coalition has plenty of isk and capitals to sustain long fighting, but half assed attacks on systems and petty forum claims won't do the job. Ingame is where it will go down, and it should go down with dedication. Instead of trying to find out whether bob posts fake killmails or doesn't upload lossmails, your energy is better spent ingame looking for ways to generate bob lossmails.
On F-T, in the long run, it won't even matter if there was a titan. If Bob loses this war then it will 'have started with their titan loss', if they win this, the coalitions demise will 'have started with the F-T shipyard trap'. It's all in the eyes of the beholders. People that want to believe there was a titan will do so anyway, as will people that want to believe it was empty. Any proof will be dismissed as fake by both parties.
That's the beauty of the game, it can be much more than 'just a game'. The amount of isk that any of the large alliances currently has out in space is a multifold of a titans worth, and the amount of isk fielded in POS attacks often exceeds this as well. On the scope of thing it doesn't come down to a single titan destruction.
Ultimately, the challenge for those against BoB is not to reply to urfunny's thread trying to disprove his points, but to remove the base of his points, namely BoBs current success ingame, or the coalitions lack of success ingame.
Damn, I must really be getting to ya d0ri5. Making an entire thread to try and call me out? Wow.
Believe whatcha will on BOB posting/not posting kills. We've only heard from every other major alliance in the game that they don't post them all kinda like we heard from every other major alliance in the game that BOB cheated. And we ALL know that THAT turned out to be TOTALLY false, right?
Also. . .please point me back to where I specifically said BOB lost a Titan in F-T. Quote me, please, because I'm fairly certain I never said any such thing. I know that BOB popped a Mom out of the POS the coalition didn't kill and I have absolutely no clue what was in the one the coalition did blow up.
Seriously, bro. . .find something better to do w/ your time. You know you're full of shit and it's sad to see someone SO attached to this shitty ass game and their alliance. If BOB is so fucking great then obviously they don't need you running your mouth on here because they'll have everyone cleaned up in no time at all, right? The more you harp on how swell they are the more pathetic you look.
Oh yeah, and btw. . .the guys told me they laughed their asses off owning that Slepnir of yours the other day in 9-9. You can't even use T2 drones? WTF? BOB's standards must be slipping....Guess it's back to the dictors and inties for you, eh? Sad.
Just on a side note here. . .since when did screenshots ever show in bright pink blinking letters "Hey Fucktards! TITAN in progress here!" ???
The build time is exactly that. . .a time. It doesn't say what's in progress, just how long it's got until it pops out. So, you see the build time and if it's ridiculously long you know you've got a Mom or a Titan. Just like in F-T. It just happened to be a Mom.
In JV1V the spies obviously got ahold of the build time plus some other intel that indicated it was a Titan. I'm sure the LV idiots were blowing their load about it all over their internal network and someone picked up on it.
I only fault coalition leaders for not putting both of the capyards into reinforced instead of just 1. It's like having two hot naked chicks on your bed and only bothering to dick one of them down. It just doesn't make sense.
But seriously. . .this F-T nonsense is old already. Who gives a flying fuck what was or wasn't there? Obviously the coalition is going to lose regardless, right? Nobody is ever going to know exactly what was or wasn't there except the people running the yards. End of story. Let's find a new Anna Nicole story to chase after. . .please. . .for my sanity.
Strange that the Coalation leaders do not make any offical annoucement that a titan was downed. I mean, a TITAN! OMG!
Since your position within the colation is no doubt equivalent of the rank of footsoldier, my suggestion is that you go up the chain to your leadership and ask your leadership to make an official annoucement that there was a Titan in the pos.
Since the Coalation is the aggressors in this instance, the burdon of proof relies on them. E.G Lets go to war with Iraq because they have WMD that can be launched in 45 mins. - It is not upto Iraq to prove it does not have WMD launchable in 45mins, it is upto the agressors to prove that it has.
This is why no coalation leader is putting his rep on the line by making a official statement - It transpired that the intel they got was hearsay and they accept it was a well laid out trap. The intel they got was also probebly part of the trap in the first place, simaler to how napoleon tricked Britan into attacking denmark.
Its odd that they did not make an official announcement that the sky is blue, or that there is hunger in africa either.
Point is. . .popping a capyard to destroy the contents is never going to be completely accurate. You're never going to have all the info before ya go in because the build time doesn't tell you exactly what is being built, it just gives you an idea. So, unless your spies are the ones actually starting the builds (would be nice) you'll never be 100% on what's in there.
Also, like I've repeated said, I don't know nor do I care what was in those capyards. Congrats to BOB if there was absolutely nothing in it at the time. Does it change a damn thing? Not really because all that we KNOW popped out was a Hel mom. In the grand scheme of things at this point that's like a drop in the bucket. On the other hand. . .F-T showed us proof of a lot of other things. Namely, that CCP will yet again step in to help out BOB and that the coalition, when they get together and coordinated, cannot be stopped unless CCP shuts the entire game down or something. That alone would give me cause for concern if I was BOB. It would make me desperate to spread the seeds of doubt and to play up my minor victories into huge ones and non-existant victories into ones that showed we were winning on all fronts....
Again, drop F-T. It's old. Find something new to rant about so we can laugh at some new material.
Amazing. Every alliance is watching bob' killboad, yet somehow, they manage to sneak in fake kills and miss out lossmails.Believe whatcha will on BOB posting/not posting kills. We've only heard from every other major alliance in the game that they don't post them all kinda like we heard from every other major alliance in the game that BOB cheated. And we ALL know that THAT turned out to be TOTALLY false, right?
It just so happens that the fake kills they make are of such quality of a forgery, that even the person who's is listed as the victim has not only found a ship missing from his hanger, but also the insurance payout, a concord evemail and also been mind controled to post the killmail on coalation killboards as well.
Not only that, but they dont post lossmails, and they are so good at hiding it, that they somehow use brain rays so that what the coalation person who killed the bob into not posting his killmail on coalation killboards.
Goodness.
But anyhow, no matter how much you hate bob, one thing has always been true - Their killboard is one of the most accurate in eve - There are hundreds of people with a pre-written flame ready to post it the second they find a fake killmail or missing lossmail on the bob killboard.
But proof is easy enough. Just check coalation killboards and see how many bob losses are missing. I checked and I cannot find a single one. Can you? You see, that makes it so much sweeter to kill a bob and get his killmail - Because you know for a fact he is going to post it and they are hard to come by.
They aren't really THAT hard to come by. We've been popping people in and around 1DH for weeks now.
The BOB kills get harder to come by when you're forced to deal w/ their supercap fleet and whatnot tho... Solo work and whatnot tho? They're still fairly average. . .but they do fly REALLY nice shit. Damage Control IIs. . .drool.
It does not matter who you are, if you get caught by a gank squad, you will die to the gank squadBut ganks dont win wars, frontline action does, so 10 people ganking in delve is 10 people missing from the front line in Fethbolias or Catch or wherever. Ganks only works when the enemy is on the defensive. If they are on the offencive, then ganks has limited effect.
I guess the allies bombing the German factories in World War II was a waste of time then. As was the Germans doing the same thing.
And the french resistance fighters tearing up the German infrastructure and causing chaos.
And the germans Sending in paratroopers behind the lines during the Battle of the bulge had no effect
And the allies wating their time sending paratroopers in during the normandy landings. Those would have been better off at the beaches
Or the germans sending raiding fleets to destroy allied shipping in the indian and pacific oceans during World War 1. Compleatly asinine. Waste of time really.
Or the german plan to dump millions of fake British notes into the british economy in order to bankrupt it was a waste of effort. (for the record they didn't actually do ahead with that. They decided to use the fake notes to help fund their own war machine!)
Want me to go on?
I guess the allies bombing the German factories in World War II was a waste of time then. As was the Germans doing the same thing.
And the french resistance fighters tearing up the German infrastructure and causing chaos.
And the germans Sending in paratroopers behind the lines during the Battle of the bulge had no effect
And the allies wating their time sending paratroopers in during the normandy landings. Those would have been better off at the beaches
Or the germans sending raiding fleets to destroy allied shipping in the indian and pacific oceans during World War 1. Compleatly asinine. Waste of time really.
Or the german plan to dump millions of fake British notes into the british economy in order to bankrupt it was a waste of effort. (for the record they didn't actually do ahead with that. They decided to use the fake notes to help fund their own war machine!)
Want me to go on?
But they did not send a dozen of their elite SS squads to hang around a street corner and mug people who pass by (Gank) and then proclaim they are conquorers! Now if you have your troops already lockdowning a city - they you can gank folk to force them to lock down. Otherwise all you end up doing is hurting your front line with less troops. In other words, you are seiging nol, got your fleet there and ganking any bob who undock - yeah thats an invasion. But that is not happening now is it?
Thats the thing - This war happens once a year for the past 4 or so years. Call it PA, call it G/IRON/RAZOR etc etc, call it Coalation its all the same leadership repeating past mistakes. The last 3 times it failed miserably, and this time, the only difference is RA/AAA and they are more intrested in running plex's than appearing on the front line.
I mean what exactly has changed from the past 3 attempts? How do you actually take over a NPC region?
There's this great misconception among BoD that Coalition would want to take over Delve...try to think a bit harder and you may come up with other tactical possibilites.
[i]Leaving the game? Send your stuffz to "Other Ideas", preferably with a very long contract[/i] - :v: [SIZE="4"]? ? ?[/SIZE]
I am thinking as hard as I can, but that is what the coalation said - They wanted to kick bob out of the game, hence kick them out of their home, which is delve. Now the only way you can do that is by invasion. How do you invade a NPC region? It is like invading lowsec pretty much. http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingamebo...3415&page=1#13 is a post where the man himself stats his objective is NOL, which can only happen with a invasion of Delve.
Unless.... the coalation wants to hand over outposts to bob + allies, which is what is currently happening, I doubt there is any kind of master plan.
Unless of course, you are refering to a McCreedy Masterplan, as we all know how well that went.
I hardly believe TheMittani speaks for Northern Coalition
As for tactics...well, lets take a look at this theoretical situation:
There's a system with 11 moons and an outpost. Alliance A is on the offensive telling everyone that they're going to kick Alliance B's ass who happen to be the owner of said outpost. To guard this outpost, B has setup 6 large POS with hard to kill setups (Death Stars or high-hp speedbumps or whatever).
A jumps in with their dreads, manages to knock all 6 POS to reinforced. They also setup one of their own during this fight. Lets assume a bit of a mess-up from FC and they lose two dreads in a process.
B reacts and rescues all their POS with their own capital fleet and return the favor by knocking A's POS to reinforced. A lets it die after the rather low amount of Strontium has run out.
What's the score so far?
A lost two dreads + POS meaning around 5bil in total losses depending how you want to calculate these losses of course.
B loses Strontium, ammo and fuels for cynojumping the capital fleet to this system. Because B uses more bigger capitals, they burn a lot more capital fuels than A.
B also lost time defending this system and most likely will lose more since after this sort of attack it's almost a tradition to enforce the system with a 3-5 extra large POSses so that it'll be extremely hard to take the system. This is the key to circumventing the current boring POS mechanics: Make the other party spend more ISK on maintaining their defensive network in the long run than you and you will eventually "win" if such thing is even possible in a game in which you can't die.
Also if Coalition would be more organized at the moment, imagine doing the thing above on system 1 and when it gets to the setupping more towers-part, go to system 2 and do the same again. With an interesting variation one party could also try stealing sovereignity by POS spamming and when they've done that, knock all hostile POS to reinforced and then offline all but one of their own POS. Important part is that you don't actually destroy those hostile POSses because then they're not lost assets to the hostile party and they have to either come defend those towers or suffer a moral defeat.
Come on, it can't be that hard to think of these sort of scenarios? Weren't you BoD guys supposed to be masterminds of all evil?
[i]Leaving the game? Send your stuffz to "Other Ideas", preferably with a very long contract[/i] - :v: [SIZE="4"]? ? ?[/SIZE]
You assume everyone is bod. The first point is that the above tactics dont work against any alliance that has a large capital fleet. Deathstar POS's no longer exist. It is virtually impossible to lose dreads to pos defences, unless the person in charge of the gang of dreads is a total idiot, and the dread pilots are also total idiots. The chance of a competent pilot losing a dread to pos defences is the same as someone losing a Navy Raven, Gist-X Fitted to a lvl 2 mission. You can even tank Deathstar pos's with a carrier for goosness sake now, so the days of the Lagpos killing the dread before it loads no longer exists, since there is no excuse for not having a loading spot.I hardly believe TheMittani speaks for Northern Coalition
As for tactics...well, lets take a look at this theoretical situation:
There's a system with 11 moons and an outpost. Alliance A is on the offensive telling everyone that they're going to kick Alliance B's ass who happen to be the owner of said outpost. To guard this outpost, B has setup 6 large POS with hard to kill setups (Death Stars or high-hp speedbumps or whatever).
A jumps in with their dreads, manages to knock all 6 POS to reinforced. They also setup one of their own during this fight. Lets assume a bit of a mess-up from FC and they lose two dreads in a process.
B reacts and rescues all their POS with their own capital fleet and return the favor by knocking A's POS to reinforced. A lets it die after the rather low amount of Strontium has run out.
What's the score so far?
A lost two dreads + POS meaning around 5bil in total losses depending how you want to calculate these losses of course.
B loses Strontium, ammo and fuels for cynojumping the capital fleet to this system. Because B uses more bigger capitals, they burn a lot more capital fuels than A.
B also lost time defending this system and most likely will lose more since after this sort of attack it's almost a tradition to enforce the system with a 3-5 extra large POSses so that it'll be extremely hard to take the system. This is the key to circumventing the current boring POS mechanics: Make the other party spend more ISK on maintaining their defensive network in the long run than you and you will eventually "win" if such thing is even possible in a game in which you can't die.
Also if Coalition would be more organized at the moment, imagine doing the thing above on system 1 and when it gets to the setupping more towers-part, go to system 2 and do the same again. With an interesting variation one party could also try stealing sovereignity by POS spamming and when they've done that, knock all hostile POS to reinforced and then offline all but one of their own POS. Important part is that you don't actually destroy those hostile POSses because then they're not lost assets to the hostile party and they have to either come defend those towers or suffer a moral defeat.
Come on, it can't be that hard to think of these sort of scenarios? Weren't you BoD guys supposed to be masterminds of all evil?
Secondly - You are saying that the Coalation battle plan is baised upon spaming pos's in the hope that somehow the defenders will run out of fuel jumping to defend them or quit over boredom? Pos spam tactics have been heavaly nerfed since the time where RA mastered it. Back then you coul buy a 20 or 30mil small pos, dump dozens of them 1 minute before DT and after DT, Sov was yours. Nowadays that does not work - You need to use large POS's and you need 5 days to claim sov. This means that the defenders have almost week to plan things, rather than the old "OMG INSTACHARGE NOW"
Its the same old ASCN problem - Base your master plan around pos's in the wild hope that somehow... somehow the enemy will give up before your own members quit over boredom.
Given that a deathstar pos costs around a billion, and according to scrapheap, 100 to 150 coalation large pos's are downed already, thats something like 150bil pissed away. Perhaps I am not the Stratigical Genuis, but it sure appears that since bob has regained everything they have lost so far, plus a few outposts?
But then again, I bow to the master of Coalation tactics.
...unless proven otherwise.
Yes, I know that Death Stars are currently rather...castrated from their former glory. However if I were setting up POSses to defend my outpost system, I'd most likely put up some speed bumps (lots of hardeners and EW). I've never liked those large minnie gunpiles...
Almost got it. The thing is that by placing one POS to a good place you may lose ~500mil (if it's a medium one with stuff in it) ISK but it will take a lot more ISK for the other party to take it down. If you think it as stress points, if putting up one POS is worth 3 points and defending said POS is worth 1 point, how many points per destroyed POS/defense fleet would you rate running around with a capital fleet taking down 4 points worth of stress.
A lot of people also made ISK with that price change. However I think this is somewhat off subject since RA has proven it's a lot more than a POS spamming group.
For the record, I've stated earlier on this forum that Band of Brothers will win this war.
Do FLA POSses count?
On the contrary though I see a lot of holing in BoB territories when looking at influence map progression. The more important thing currently is that BoB isn't losing stations, POS or any of that crap, they're currently losing tenants which should hurt them more in the long run (remember, this is going to be a long war).
I'm not in any important place in any Coalition. Are you a mastermind in The Alliance?
As a final note, I think I should repeat myself a bit: There's two things I believe that will happen in the end:
1) BoB wins
2) Coalition loses interest to the entire game
Lets just wait 6 months and see how things roll out, shall we?
[i]Leaving the game? Send your stuffz to "Other Ideas", preferably with a very long contract[/i] - :v: [SIZE="4"]? ? ?[/SIZE]
Theres 4000 fucking people in Goons alone you 'tard. Do you really think 10-15 people is going to make a difference if they aren't in Feyth? Ironically, WE were the ones in Feyth giving CORM and their friends nothing but grief before the Goons came down. I alone have popped those white trash space goers GIT-R-DUN so many times I've lost count.
Also, quit already w/ the spin. Nobody is claiming to have conquered shit. We're chillin' in Delve "ganking" people (never mind that more than half of my kills are solo) like haulers, inties who pop cynos, ratters, etc. and it's been much fun. Our buddies in the 'Swarm meanwhile have been bending RISE over each and every day. I'd love to know when the last time RISE got to run their plex.
I mean, if it wasn't for D2 being completely lame we'd have everything locked up already. As it is, I suppose BOB will have some nice northern territory to run to once we clear the south out....
I see, so the reason coalation is losing ground back to bob in the east is because D2 has lost in the north?
Also
Exceuse me if I am wrong, but were their not 4000 people in ASCN as well? Did that 10-15 people doing their own thing make a difference when there were not in feth? In theiry it should not, but in reality - thats the beguinning of the end. Looks like its a repeat of the same things that killed ASCN.Theres 4000 fucking people in Goons alone you 'tard. Do you really think 10-15 people is going to make a difference if they aren't in Feyth?
In theiry? I dunno what the fuck theiry is, but trying to compare the coalition forces in the east to ASCN is. . .well. . .just plain pathetic. If you're getting that desperate for material I suggest you just hang it up now.
Sorry, but anyone who thinks that the coalition is like a Hive mind which can control all of its parts at once w/ smooth and seamless efficiency needs to have their heads examined. All that Goons and RA and AAA and Iron and the rest of us in the East can hope for is that D2 pulls their heads outta their collective ass. As I recall. . .we didn't all have a sit-down after the T20 incident and decide as a collective to fight BOB. We didn't all cut our palms and do handshakes by a fire while eating Smores. Everyone just got fucking fed up w/ BOB's bullshit and it was on. D2 decided to attack BOB from the North on their own and now they're dealing w/ the consequences of that.
Also. . .enough already w/ the "losing ground" to BOB argument. What ground has been lost? Seems to me like the only folks that have lost ground are LV (all of it) and now D2 is losing some space. Goons still owns every station it did after LV got the boot and I don't see any other coalition forces streaming away w/ tears on their faces from lost stations. Do you? Seriously, if there's one thing that wears people out more than anything else it's this shit from BOB and their bitches where they say outlandish absurd things and act like it's the word of God. "Coalition forces are losing all their space! Oh noes the war is gonna be over in 2 weeks!" Of course you say this right after d0ri5 and you berate everyone in the coalition for supposedly saying the war would be won in a month or some bullshit.
Seriously. . .until BOB starts taking space that never belonged to them in the first place. . .STFU and save us this nonsense.
Oh yeah. . .and again. . .comparing ASCN to the eastern coalition?
A quick look at the sov map for the past few weeks shows bob taken over c3-, which never belong to them, now did it?
Oh my word! BOB took over a KOS system which KOS took from someone else and which isn't anywhere near Feyth, oh noes!! And who did C3 belong to before KOS took it over? Really, you've put yourself in a tough position. You've been spouting off all this shit but one quick look at the map shows that you haven't a clue. One more quick look at all the pet KBs shows that you're living on another plane of reality. One final look at morale blogs from the Bobbits and posts from their pets who are pissing themselves in fear, anger, mistrust and we all realize that we should stop listening to you. . .as if we ever needed to in the first place except out of a slight sense of amusement. . .kinda like the one you'd get from watching a retard stumble around and trip over his own feet.
So lets answer the question then. Are bob ganing ground, takeing over station they never had before or are they not?
When they start taking over goon stations, are you going to say "ah but they were LV stations anywayso it does not count"?
C3- was ISS'. It was known as the Calico Project and as such had a heavy influence on ruining ISS' reputation as a free-for-all, neutral alliance.
[i]Leaving the game? Send your stuffz to "Other Ideas", preferably with a very long contract[/i] - :v: [SIZE="4"]? ? ?[/SIZE]
So, now I am Dori5 again? I thought we decided there was not anyone named that in BoB?
Killboard argument is old. You lose. No proof and your rantings about "So and so said it was true so it MUST be true." dont work. FAIL.
Sorry if I said you did. I asked for proof of what others are claiming. Sorry. Again, is there any proof?
No, actually the coalition has to clean them up. Remember "The rapetrain hasnt any brakes."?
? Not even sure what this is?Oh yeah, and btw. . .the guys told me they laughed their asses off owning that Slepnir of yours the other day in 9-9. You can't even use T2 drones? WTF? BOB's standards must be slipping....Guess it's back to the dictors and inties for you, eh? Sad.
As stated before, it was the coalition who said they would be taking NOL, hence Delve.
ASCN thought they were winning by using POS spam, as does coalition.
ASCN thought offense meant roaming gank squads in Delve, so does coalition.
ASCN thought it was ok for members to not be on the front lines, as does the coalition.
ASCN thought that BoB would get bored, as does the coalition.
ASCN lost almost every major fleet battle, as has the coalition.
ASCN lost a ton of capitals and replied "Those losses are no big deal.", as has the coalition.
I could go on and on...
Actually D2 entered the conflict because the coalition spent a week on the forums begging them to.
Actually as has been pointed out already, you lose this argument as well.
I think it was you who asked for "proof" and it was provided. Much more than the RA fanbois on here can do with any of their claims. I looked at the map and didnt see anything to present a contrary view to the one EVE#### presented. The coalition is taking a beat down on every front of the war.
of course you are wrong..
in the Q front, FIX is getting slaughtered, embarased and pulverized every day for 2-3 months now. many of them have left, they have no capable fc left. This will be a war of atrition in Q. More of them will leave by themself, at the end there will be hardly any fix in Q... one can take only so much assrapeing. Actually there is hardly any fix to be foound there now. They themself will pack up and lave or disolve very soon.
On the South front. LV is gone (ppl seem to forget to mention that when they cite achievements). RA are runing bob/pets plexes and RISE cannot pay rent. that is just pure comedy gold. It can hardly be any more embarasing for BOB and co. There is no beating taken on this front.
On the North front: Yes, coalition is taking beating partly becouse BOB has gained new and this time improved lap doggy pets: AXE. Also YouWhat were underestimated by the coalition. All those factors combined with the MC make that the only sicessfull front for you.
So 1 right out of 3. That is an record for you... enjoy
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