Changing Titans role is dumb as is nerfing them over and over in hopes it changes things. Its simple Delete Titans refund the owners the mins of the ship. Delete Titan Skills , Delete Doomsday device skill refund the skillpoints to those that had it trained. In its place introduce a new capital/supercap that acts as a Jumpbridge/Gangbonus/Support platform. Let players make the choice if they want to invest Skillpoints into that path.
PROBLEM SOLVED FOREVER
PL posters always say that people should spend more time thinking about counters to titans instead of asking for them to be nerfed.
Well, I am fairly confident that thousands of players have put their minds to this particular task at one time or another since Dominion launched. We've had many alliances consider their options, including FCs that are now in PL themselves.
Despite this fact, no definitive counter to the post-Dominion Titan blob has ever emerged.
Since you are all apparently selling yours and/or quitting Eve forever, can you once and for all share those elusive secrets with the rest of us?
Post-dominion they are the highest EHP ships in the game, and they have a good chance of fighting back against everything from AB-fit T3 cruisers to Dreads.
Is that a big change? I sure think so. Pre-Dominion titans were indeed great at killing sub-caps, but dread fleets were generally only tickled by AoE DDs.
Delete titans only refund SP. Former titan owners can bury their face in their personal tech moons and cry the pain away. Unless you're in CFC in which case you don't get shit. This rewards people who used them before they losed them without breaking the economy.
Dreads are not a problem in any sense of the word, its titans, why would any change to make titans weaker need to have anything to do with dreads?
As far as i know Dreads are anti structure AND anti capital platforms, they always have been.
You're reaching really hard on this one tgr and not really getting anywhere, you've spent the past 2 pages imposing your personal beliefs as actual game design, you've bought corporate propaganda like it was stocks and bonds, the whole while ignoring every bit of factual evidence.
I'm pretty sure titans' current role as subcap-blappers dovetails perfectly with CCP intending them to be an anti-capital platform.
Or are you saying drones were there to help in shooting structures or capitals?
The main problem is that they're sharing the guns with dreads, and they're trying to balance fucking dreads over with fucking titans over wrt subcaps, and I'm not sure if they've thought of just making titan guns XXL or something. But I'm not taking that as a "yes, please, use titans to rape subcaps with impunity", because that's obviously not what CCP wants. It's literally written in every devblog I've googled forth about titans, and it's evident in literally every change they've made to supercarriers AND titans since the post-AOE DD era began.
Removing my ability to launch 5 drones wasn't one of them. Removing my ability to kill one guy every 10 minutes wasn't one of them.
Removing my ability to kill one every 5.8 seconds with my guns would be a good start, but even with this coming change they couldn't even get that part right, AND they fucked with dreads in the process.
theres fighters that can hit subcaps and fighterbombers that cant
theres dreads that can hit subcaps and seige modules that cant
theres titans that can hit subcaps and oh wait lols
Does it bother you to know that everything you said there was wrong? (fighterbombers still do fairly impressive DPS to bs and Dreads can hit sub caps in siege in the right conditions)
It can't possibly be that they haven't thought it was as big of a problem until you drug your titan nuts across their face a few times, and then went "oh dear, that just won't do at all" and are now scrambling madly for ideas on how to this, and probably will flub the first iteration?
Scrambling madly to fix something for six months stops being scrambling madly, especially when after six months the solution that they come up with is utter shit and doesn't do a damn thing to address the problem.
This is not fucking rocket science, people weren't being raped by titans and their 5 drones. They weren't losing fleets to supercaps drones either, you were all told this when the winter is coming shit started, none of you have ever seemed to grasp that it was the titans raping your fleets, and it was their guns doing the work. Great, DD's took out a single ship, guns kill about 10 per minute, so over the course of one dead guy from one DD, 100 people die to titan guns.
Forest fucking gump could have come up with a solution to this problem in the time that CCP have been mulling it over.
In other words, you are taking the intentions specified in all the devblogs, and the direction all changes have had, totally ignoring that and focusing squarely on the fact that CCP haven't, say, changed all titan guns to XXL guns that just can't hit subcaps even if they stood still, or just removed the possibility to target subcaps in any way, shape or form, as a "yes, titans are supposed to be a subcap weapon"?
See, now you're ignoring the fact that CCP have made actual changes, and not just typed out words. And there's coherency between what they've written, and the changes they've made. And apparently to some extent the changes they'll continue to make.
I mean It's almost like I already told you that I'm dumb and ignorant and therefore need things spelling out for me in quantified detail.
Its just that the changes are laughable when the solutions available and the stated goal is significantly easier than all the dumb shit combined: Just take away the fucking guns and gun bonuses completely.
Ohterwise nothing you do short of completely altering the way guns work in EVE will stop titans from hitting sub caps.
Mouth meet Moneyhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default...78&#post956978
Dear CSM & CCP;
Hello I fly a Titan class vessel in a corporation with many Titan Class vessel's in a Alliance with the most Titan class vessels. My alliance uses Titans more than anyother organization in game. I am advocating the Deletion of all Ttitan Class vessels :FULL STOP:. I am also advocating the deletion of all Titan specific skills from the database ( Racial Titan skill , Doomsday device Operation) :FULL STOP: I am also advocating the removal of all Titan BPO/BPC's and Titan specific component BPO/BPC as well as any and all Doomsday Device BPOS/BPC's :FULL STOP:.
In compensation to the effected pilots I am advocating the return of the minerals for the build of the Titan and its Doomsday Device all equipped modules and equipment within the Titan to be moved to JITA 4-4 so effected pilots can easily decide what to do with the assets at that point. Reimburse all skillpoints from the deleted Titan specific skills as has been done in the past with other skill deletions.Make this change at the exact same time compounds are removed from Drone Region NPC's. This will offset the vacuum left from that change and soften the potential flood of minerals to market from Titan deletion with both changes counter-balancing each other ( perhaps not perfectly).
After the deletion or at the time of deletion ( If CCP can make it happen "time constraints" ) Introduce a new capital or supercapital platform. This supercapital platform would have specific skills required to pilot it and specific BPO's to produce it . This new platform would have no offensive capability only defensive. Its role would be a support/logistic capital/supercap. It would do things such as create Jumpbridges , Provide Gang bonuses , Have a large corporate hanger and Ship maintnence array to support its fleet.
My arguments for this are pretty simple. Changing Titans to do this job is silly as not that many would be required to achieve having enough to support the role. Currently there are more titans in game that what would be needed to outfit all nullsec/lowsec groups with this important role. Furthermore a very large portion of Titan pilots did not train for over a year or spend billions upon billions acquiring a hull or further billions upon billions acquiring modules to outfit a Titan that has been deemed since inception to be a offensive roled hull to have it suddenly changed to a non offensive hull.
The Supercarrier will retain the role as the dominant force in Supercapital warfare specializing in laying waste to capital class vessels and sovereignty structures. This is also a stealth buff for Dreadnaughts as they will be used in greater frequency to shoot POS & Sov Structures in the abscense of Titans.I make the assertion with the complete removal of Titans and a addition of Support/Role Supercapital we will see a more dynamic player experience. With more specific roles for players to fill instead of Titans dominating the battlefield of all types.
AKA Manfred Sideous
( would have posted with Manny but he is banned from telling screegs to go fuck himself over censoring K.com)
Enlighten me. I've already accepted I'm dumb, so you don't need to make that point. Just tell me.
[05:28:32] Damienwhat Solette > friend said, if only they didn't have those 2 falcons there, i said they have 3, and he said that just says they don't want to do anything fair, just want to be dicks about it like not normal dicks but big black huge cocks
And if you're one of the lowsec groups that use Dreads, or one of the wormhole guys who fight in unsieged dreads, then yes, you've effectively been fucked in the ass by this patch.
Tracking Change does change fuck all for WH Sites. You have subcaps webbing/painting the NPC BS and they pop like candy.
Just like Maelstroms still will after the Patch.
Not sure why anyone would fight in an unsieged Dread, might just as well bring a BS then.
The only way to balance EVE would be to make every ship have exactly the same stats. Imagine, the greatest Rifterdome ever known! It would be paradise
Someone propose it to CCP
They'll need to be removed entirely, but while CCP wants to figure out what to do with them removing the guns and weapon bonuses will serve to meet their stated goal of not having them kill sub caps.
Literally NOTHING else will work. If you leave them guns, people will get shot, if you nerf them hard enough to make them miss, you kill the dread because of the way they're approaching the nerf.
The role CCP is trying to define for the titan, Titan pilots do not want, thats not ever what the ship has been about and its not why any of them ever bought the ship. You don't cater to a part of your player base thats not going to keep the titan for what you intend it for anyway.
Neuter it completely, those that are going to dump that account will dump it no matter what role they assign in next anyway, as they only bought them to fight with.
So get it over and done with.
A sieged dread's tracking right now is:Originally Posted by CCP Greyscale
(base_xl_turret_tracking * mods_skills_etc) * 0.5
Their proposed change is:
(base_xl_turret_tracking * 0.5) * mods_skills_etc
which is the same thing. Are you saying that it isn't?
It's a sort of extreme solution, but I don't see another way of fixing it.