CCP intervenes to reinforce node... For BOB of course

[wildcat84]

http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingamebo...983&page=6#162

We do have hardware monitors in place that will tell us if CPU or memory, is getting overloaded on a machine in the cluster. Tihs happens most commonly during fleet battles. Usually the course of action is to leave it as is, however there were two things different about the battle yesterday that caused us to decide to re-map it.

- Firstly, it was causing repeated node deaths, which is not good and something we very much wish to avoid. We are going to very closely analyse why this was and ensure that it gets fixed asap.

- Secondly, we have some newer hardware quite recently installed that we thought would be able to handle it a bit better. With the battle causing lots of problems running where it was on the existing hardware we decided to move it over to one of the new machines and see what happened.

I hope that makes things a little clearer.

Mindstar

Of course, BOB benefited and was able to get back into the node before the NNC guys (inside info perhaps?):

By this time the battle had shifted from MSHD to MO where NC was successfully preventing GBC from entering MO from Taisy. At this point the node crashed once again (# 6 or 7 I had lost count by then). Now it was at this point that CCP brought on the node repair. The funny part is that the repair now allowed BoB to enter MO in force while NC was not able to load back into game in enough time to do anything to prevent the incursion. This means that BoB was able to load AND enter MO while NC could not even load fast enough to do anything. I'll leave the more programing adept to answer why.
At this point after 6 node crashes prior, I don't know who requested what.

It's completely unprecedented for CCP to intervene in an ongoing battle, they mostly refuse. While the stuff they did was cool, IMHO, until they are ready to deploy this EVERYWHERE, and have done so that intervening when CCP has a past with favoritism for BOB due to Devs being in there is not appropriate.

Just my opinion, and figured this deserved to be here as just another example of EVE being a two-tier game, ie, rules for BOB and rules for everyone else.

[NotARealName]

Prior to now, CCP wasn't even able to intervene in a battle. The introduction of Stackless I/O is what has allowed them to do dynamic node reallocation. Prior to that, changes had to be made at DT. You're going to see CCP be much more proactive now that they can send fleet battles off to their own nodes as they happen.

And while it certainly seems odd that BoB has benefited the most, I really doubt they're getting any special favors here.

[Yorda]

Or, more likely, MO crashed while bob wasnt in the system. They quickly tried jumping in when it was coming up and got in faster than the NC trying to load game.


Shitty game mechanics giving BoB an advantage? well I never.

[wildcat84]

Prior to now, CCP wasn't even able to intervene in a battle. The introduction of Stackless I/O is what has allowed them to do dynamic node reallocation. Prior to that, changes had to be made at DT. You're going to see CCP be much more proactive now that they can send fleet battles off to their own nodes as they happen.

And while it certainly seems odd that BoB has benefited the most, I really doubt they're getting any special favors here.

You'd think given the past that CCP would have gone out of their way to AVOID appearing to be acting on behalf of BOB. I mean, it's not as a CCP Dev didn't get caught RED HANDED aiding his mates in Bob is it?

This really shows that CCP is pretty damn amateurish in the PR department. Or they are just that unprofessional and corrupt.

There have been plenty of other laggy battles around that didn't involve them that they could have tried this out on.

Furthermore, having done this, CCP has, in my mind, set a precedent that obliges them to do the same for everyone else everywhere else. Failing to do so would also open up things for "oh well, BOB's not involved, guess they play favorites", and as I said, given the past, people would be completely justified in thinking and saying that.

[Berious]

If this was the first chance they had to test out their fancy bew stackless I/O related shit in a super laggy node crash fest fleet fight then fair enough.

Going out of their way to avoid appearing to help BoB would be bad as "We got yo backs brosefs" IMO. It's a horribly slippery slope if they'd do stuff with an eye on how it'd look based on past events, assuming they're acting honorably now.

[theTwilitehour]

Its not that I think that BoB is getting free favors from CCP necessarily, but I do start to wonder when it seems like EVERY node crash, every Post log in scenario, every clusterfuck of this sort sees BoB winning unequivocally, able to log in rapidly after the node crash and the other side unable to.

And don't give me that bullshit about enemies not being willing to log in. Everyone is well aware of how important it is to get in as fast as possible, yet somehow it's always BoB.

[wildcat84]

Its not that I think that BoB is getting free favors from CCP necessarily, but I do start to wonder when it seems like EVERY node crash, every Post log in scenario, every clusterfuck of this sort sees BoB winning unequivocally, able to log in rapidly after the node crash and the other side unable to.

And don't give me that bullshit about enemies not being willing to log in. Everyone is well aware of how important it is to get in as fast as possible, yet somehow it's always BoB.

If you have Devs who tell you exactly when the cluster is likely to accept reconnections, this could explain it.

But yeah, it would be more believable if it didn't seem that EVERY instance of severe lag+node crashes didn't seem to always see Bob with the "luck" on their side.

As I previously said, CCP should have known better than to do this for the first time in a fight involving BOB, and one where they seemed to get the better of CCP's machinations. CAOD is being "reinforced" by lots of locked posts where, yes, the T20 scam is being brought back up. Their nazi mod tactics too are only helping reinforce that bob is the golden child of the Devs.

I still can't understand why they didn't fire T20. I mean, unless the guy is just a total fucking irreplaceable Einstein (which I doubt) he could have been replaced by any of hundreds of other Devs they could have hired. And by "fucking irreplaceable Einstein" I am referring to the level of talent that he'd have to have to even BEGIN to think of it maybe even equaling the downside, especially given the fact that the whistle blower (Kug) was punished and permabanned, whilst T20, the perp, was not.

The best thing CCP could have done to put the whole thing behind them would have been to have him out of the building faster than security can throw him and his boxes of stuff into the parking lot. And hell, even if Iceland has weird ass employment laws that makes it so an employer can't even fire someone when they do commit fraud at their job to the point to discredit the company and their product they'd been better off paying him to NOT come to work.

Plus, they still refuse to come clean about exactly how many Devs are in each of the powerblocs, nor to have any independent oversight, which the CSM was originally supposed to be. They have this one "internal affairs" guy who is nothing more than a Dev tasked to the job. Who in his time has done exactly, what?

His real job is to probably make sure that whatever the Devs are doing, they dont' fuck up like T20 and get caught in a way that customers can find out, that's what he's doing... As evidenced by the fact that NO OTHER Dev HAS been caught since T20. CCP is insulting our intelligence to expect us to believe that T20 was nothing more than the fool stupid enough to get caught, that other Devs weren't doing the same or worse...

[Yorda]

So apparently the entire node crashed like 8 times and each time both sides slowly got back in. Looks like MM where doing pretty well then when they reinforced the node BoB got back in before MM and slowly slaughtered everyone who was trying to get in. The MM killboard is just ridiculous right now, something like 2 carriers, 23 dreads, and a mothership lost with 0 capital kills.

I'm not going to break out my tinfoil hat, but I will sit back and laugh at how fucking terrible this game can be.

[wildcat84]

So apparently the entire node crashed like 8 times and each time both sides slowly got back in. Looks like MM where doing pretty well then when they reinforced the node BoB got back in before MM and slowly slaughtered everyone who was trying to get in. The MM killboard is just ridiculous right now, something like 2 carriers, 23 dreads, and a mothership lost with 0 capital kills.

I'm not going to break out my tinfoil hat, but I will sit back and laugh at how fucking terrible this game can be.

I checked with some friends who were in today's fighting and they said that basically almost no one is even getting kill or lossmails, so statistics can be misleading.

Also there are people who lost ships that because of the rollback(s) ended up with their ships, minus mods that got blown up, AND their insurance payouts, so it may not be all that horrible for them.

[Viro Melchior]

I concur that CCP need to be MUCH more careful about their relationship with BoB. Sure, they shouldn't "shun" BoB either, but the situation that they are in:

CCP has past issues with playing BoB favorites
BoB has a reputation for benefiting (most) from Dev intercessions at an overwhelming ratio (arguably 100%, but guaranteed 4:1 or higher)
CCP will not release any information of where Devs have players, nor will they shut off out-of-game communication lines between players and (known) developers (versus still allowing a dev to use Vent while pretending to be not-a-dev).
BoB is not in danger of dieing, and so CCP aren't condeming BoB should they put off introducing a new system until BoB aren't involved.
CCP locks all threads instead of properly solving accusations
Kug got banned, T20 is still employed (as aforementioned)
CCP won't make the Internal Affairs investigations open to public scrutiny either.


What all this means is that CCP *should* have waited to test their new system when BoB was not involved. BoB may have lost the battle (and that sucks for the Devs who don't want that to happen), but CCP would be saved this new strike against their reputation concerning favoritism. I'm sure another fight will break out soon that pushes the limits. Hell, I'm sure if CCP disceetly asked/bribed an alliance leader somewhere they could even get it to happen faster, and with smaller repurcussions than have appeared now.

[wildcat84]

I concur that CCP need to be MUCH more careful about their relationship with BoB. Sure, they shouldn't "shun" BoB either, but the situation that they are in:

CCP has past issues with playing BoB favorites
BoB has a reputation for benefiting (most) from Dev intercessions at an overwhelming ratio (arguably 100%, but guaranteed 4:1 or higher)
CCP will not release any information of where Devs have players, nor will they shut off out-of-game communication lines between players and (known) developers (versus still allowing a dev to use Vent while pretending to be not-a-dev).
BoB is not in danger of dieing, and so CCP aren't condeming BoB should they put off introducing a new system until BoB aren't involved.
CCP locks all threads instead of properly solving accusations
Kug got banned, T20 is still employed (as aforementioned)
CCP won't make the Internal Affairs investigations open to public scrutiny either.


What all this means is that CCP *should* have waited to test their new system when BoB was not involved. BoB may have lost the battle (and that sucks for the Devs who don't want that to happen), but CCP would be saved this new strike against their reputation concerning favoritism. I'm sure another fight will break out soon that pushes the limits. Hell, I'm sure if CCP disceetly asked/bribed an alliance leader somewhere they could even get it to happen faster, and with smaller repurcussions than have appeared now.

They could very easily tested this on Sisi, by asking everyone to log in, jump into some free ships, and go blow the hell out of each other.

Then it shouldn't have made it to TQ until ready to roll out everywhere, so that everyone received the same benefit.

And yes, while I could accept them not naming names, they SHOULD at least release summaries or statistics of IA actions.

My gut tells me that they originally intended to do things as first announced, use IA to "clean the mess" and then the CSM to take over, but their investigation probably revealed fraud and cheating to the point that if it became public they'd have lost thousands of players. Which is why they put up the stone walls.

And, after some thinking, I did come up with ANOTHER reason for them keeping T20 and suffering the bad PR: If things were as bad as we think, and it was "wild wild west" with Dev cheating being COMMONPLACE, and far more egregious than what we know of, they could be employing him to keep him silent.

[theTwilitehour]

What all this means is that CCP *should* have waited to test their new system when BoB was not involved. BoB may have lost the battle (and that sucks for the Devs who don't want that to happen), but CCP would be saved this new strike against their reputation concerning favoritism. I'm sure another fight will break out soon that pushes the limits. Hell, I'm sure if CCP disceetly asked/bribed an alliance leader somewhere they could even get it to happen faster, and with smaller repurcussions than have appeared now.

This is the main issue I have, when push comes to shove. Given their past misdeeds, why is CCP so fucking blind to how it looks when something like this goes down. When CCP first tried the DT node reinforcement thing it was a BoB+ACSN invasion of G space, so instead of the system lagging so badly the POS simply raped the invaders, G got locked out by the blob of ACSN+BOB, couldn't even get in system to defend, and all G pos were destroyed, pretty much with ease.

I almost think CCP is just incredibly fucking retarded when it comes to thinking about the consequences of their actions and how they will appear, not all that overtly corrupt (t20 thing aside.)

[wildcat84]

This is the main issue I have, when push comes to shove. Given their past misdeeds, why is CCP so fucking blind to how it looks when something like this goes down. When CCP first tried the DT node reinforcement thing it was a BoB+ACSN invasion of G space, so instead of the system lagging so badly the POS simply raped the invaders, G got locked out by the blob of ACSN+BOB, couldn't even get in system to defend, and all G pos were destroyed, pretty much with ease.

I almost think CCP is just incredibly fucking retarded when it comes to thinking about the consequences of their actions and how they will appear, not all that overtly corrupt (t20 thing aside.)

This is why you don't try things on a live server environment that you haven't thoroughly tested on a test server. You don't bring it to live until you know EXACTLY what it will do. Why the fuck even HAVE a test server if you are just going to experiment on live?

Unfortunately most MMO publishers, including CCP, seem to feel that their software isn't in need of sensible development procedures, and they often use their paying, live server audiences as beta testers. Look at SWG, it's gone from alpha to beta to alpha to beta more than once. It's still barely beta, even years after the NGE.

Believe it or not, having come from there, CCP isn't nearly as bad. But to try a grand experiment like a totally new node design, ON live, untested, in the middle of a major battle IS very irresponsible.

[Carebear]

What a load of fucking shit. CCP is now creating lag to make bob win. Yeah right. Remember J1V1 where LV, who apparently had GM's in them, could not even log in to save their titan? Remember how many node crash's and eventually a dev reinfoced?

FFS, if you are going to bullshit, then do it right. Stackless IO and other newer tech is here to stay. Reality is that NC is a load of shit players who lived without reds for too long and are paying the price now.

[doc]

To be honest before the crash (few minutes after the double DD), the lag was correct, i was able to travel, lock, and shoot at stuffs...

But then it went horrible. none of our alliance (well exept 2 guys in their rollbacked ships) was able to relog while bob was entering the system...


At one time I had the caracter selection (with the 3 portraits) AND an overview (with my brackets and all the option) in the same screen ! wtf ?

Again, i doubt that the reloging process is fair by design, it's statistically not possible...

[puttycat]

Unfortunately it only takes one dev or GM to tell an ingame buddy that the node is back up.... now!... to have a huge advantage over your enemy. the first batch of people will load relatively ok and in time while the rest logs in to a huge backlog queue. From that point it's a matter of picking off people one at a time.

Yuk (I don't care too much whether it's BoB or the north doing this, just a flamebait towards the major issue of conflict of interest)

[BoB Spy]

Just another reason not to get involved in the political dickfights and instead stick to the smaller and more robust 0.0 combat in the NPC regions.

[doc]

http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingamebo...hreadID=885925

molle, the story teller....

i bet he is so awesome that he had typed this post BEFORE the battle

[wildcat84]

Unfortunately it only takes one dev or GM to tell an ingame buddy that the node is back up.... now!... to have a huge advantage over your enemy. the first batch of people will load relatively ok and in time while the rest logs in to a huge backlog queue. From that point it's a matter of picking off people one at a time.

Yuk (I don't care too much whether it's BoB or the north doing this, just a flamebait towards the major issue of conflict of interest)

I know some people who once were in the GBC, and there are some things that bob does to deal with lag that make sense. But they were things that I do, and that most people do (such as set your overview properly, remove brackets, cut your graphics down, etc). Sensible stuff, but it still doesn't explain the "logonski" phenomenon.

And yeah, it only takes one tip off to a bobbit leader via MSN or somesuch from a Dev or GM buddy that the node is rebooting and should accept connections by X.

One thing that strikes me as possible is that bob probably knows more than anyone else, due to their dev connections, how the server and systems work, ie; how long from when X message appears on the client that you can log into Y, etc.

If this is the case, surely some disaffected former GBC might spill the beans.

[Firelord]

Unfortunately it only takes one dev or GM to tell an ingame buddy that the node is back up.... now!... to have a huge advantage over your enemy. the first batch of people will load relatively ok and in time while the rest logs in to a huge backlog queue. From that point it's a matter of picking off people one at a time.

Yuk (I don't care too much whether it's BoB or the north doing this, just a flamebait towards the major issue of conflict of interest)

Nothing new really, this came up a in the ASCN war. Read this thread

http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?t=181

FL

[Goberth Ludwig]

As a pioneer of the whining about bob logging back in first (2+ years ago) I demand royalties of this thread.

But seriously back then all you did was laugh at ascn and tell us to setup our overviews... well NC guys setup your overviews right and stop crying already

[ansecos]

All I see here is a lot of assumption. Right now it just looks like crappy NC tactics and shittacular game mechanics turned the tide in the battle.
If you guys want evidence, get Kug to find some. Because right now it's just "omg i cant get in ccp spl0its"

[doc]

All I see here is a lot of assumption. Right now it just looks like crappy NC tactics and shittacular game mechanics turned the tide in the battle.
If you guys want evidence, get Kug to find some. Because right now it's just "omg i cant get in ccp spl0its"

From my point of view it's obvious than just relog asap after a node crash does not result in a correctly distributed login (ie each faction get the same % logged back over time).

It's easy to imagine a lot of differents factors but i have no evidence of what is really happening.

Only a in depth review of the source code that is on production may help to c/d a lot of things.

[theTwilitehour]

All I see here is a lot of assumption. Right now it just looks like crappy NC tactics and shittacular game mechanics turned the tide in the battle.
If you guys want evidence, get Kug to find some. Because right now it's just "omg i cant get in ccp spl0its"

the problem is you aren't examining the whole scope of the problem. For year this has been going on, I literally cannot remember a node crash/relog scenario where BoB was not severely advantaged. If it was just this time, yeah sure, but theres been like 3 multiple node crashes in the north in the last week, and each time the multiple crashing ends and BoB comes out on top.

[theTwilitehour]

As a pioneer of the whining about bob logging back in first (2+ years ago) I demand royalties of this thread.

But seriously back then all you did was laugh at ascn and tell us to setup our overviews... well NC guys setup your overviews right and stop crying already

Not everyone said or thought this. Lots of people nodded or agreed but didn't post, or hope to see proof. Just because fucking idiots talk shit and take the side of the winner every time doesn't mean that is everyone.

You ever heard of the silent majority?

[Yorda]

http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingamebo...hreadID=885925

molle, the story teller....

i bet he is so awesome that he had typed this post BEFORE the battle

Ahahaha, guys it was just STRATEGY that we logged in before them. Do you really have your head that far up your ass molle?

[mc1]

I can't believe there are so many fucking morons here lol.

Its a case of we lost so it must be:-
Dev Hax, Hacked Client etc.

The 15 BoB Caps dead the other day are long forgotten......

[Hubris [banned]]

you never use untested software on a live environment. Basic rule #1 of test engineer/software engineer.

second there should be a pause type button in session changes/actions on a node. This would make it viable to restart a crashed node and allow nearly everyone to login, then fight once a 10 to 30 minute countdown to server going active is done.


Oh wait that would be tooo logical for ccp.. Implement something that makes sense, oh fuck can't do that. But here have a bpo brutha...........

[theTwilitehour]

I can't believe there are so many fucking morons here lol.

Its a case of we lost so it must be:-
Dev Hax, Hacked Client etc.

The 15 BoB Caps dead the other day are long forgotten......

So you're claiming that losing a normal battle is somehow proof that every time a node crashes and BoB comes out on top is not suspicious? I hate to break it to you, but it actually helps prove the point.

Nothing funky with server = BoB loss
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.

This is a summary of the last 4 engagements.

[bobtheknob]

I don't know why anybody would jump into a 200 man gatecamp anymore, let alone the 350 molle said he had. This makes me sad, the earlier you turn up to a fight the more likely you are to win and the less likely you are to get a fight(unless your enemy is retarded).

[k]

Until more solid evidence of CCP cheating comes to light I'm prepared to give them benefit of the doubt and assume the massive reputation hit they took has scared them out of future shenanigans.

From the sounds of things NC were just epically bad, under prepared and poorly disciplined. So I'm mainly mad we didn't get to kill 50+ capital lemmings first.

It's really not that hard to take a minimal amount of planning, everyone knew it was going to be a clusterfuck, yet NC FCs manage to do mistakes that make me wonder who's in charge of that shit.

It's not like they didn't have POSes online, and when BoB was in system with 500 dudes you know that system is pretty fucked. On the other hand, it's clear that keeping your cool and try to log back in is the only thing to do in such situations, yet they haven't grasped it, yet.

Sigh.

[Dinique]

You have to one seriously dumb motherfucker to think that this was a case of CCP helping BOB out.

[Hubris [banned]]

i remember while killing JV1V (or whatever that LV system was) those that were logged out for hours were getting found or probed and killed. Ship stayed in system even tho they were logged out for way more than enough time. This could have contributed to the cap massacre.

[Shadoo]

Well, it's funny to see all the tinfoiling here.

But the thruth is from what I can gather is pretty simple. NC lost control of M-O, BoB kept it and disabled any tower that could be used to bridge in support. BoB held system before and had the advantage of safe towers to regroup/logon at. The fact NC outnumbered in pilots is pointless -- you knew vast majority of you would die without ever loading if you bridged/jumped on anything but a friendly deathstar (which doesn't provide too much cover anyway nowadays -- but it's far better than the alternative).

You can't just form a huge fucking blob and expect to brute your way into a system -- the result is often the same regardless of scale. The ones who put in the effort to secure system and prevent safe bridge-in spots usually comes out on top despite numerical superioty of the opponent.

This reminds me of smaller events recently where defenders thought if you bridge/jump into a loaded systems with attackers having system/position advantage you can have a fair fight. EVE doesn't work that way and whoever thought it was a smart idea to jump/bridge into that system at a gate needs to re-evaluate strategies.

[theTwilitehour]

You have to one seriously dumb motherfucker to think that this was a case of CCP helping BOB out.

Really? Do you?

Lets just say, for example, that there is a Dev in BoB. To me this would come as little or no surprise. Node crashes due to the number of players in system. This Dev is monitoring the game, maybe its part of his job whatever, maybe he gets emails from the system, whatever. At the same time he is on teamspeak and trying to play in this very same crash. Nobody knows what exactly is happening, except devs, and how the server functions exactly, but lets just say the node reboot process works like this ..............X............ up to point X the node is not functioning correctly, and attempted log ins will be clusterfucked, but at point X the node is ready and incoming connections are allowed and start loading in to game. When the node hits point X, BoB dev says on MSN "I just closed client and re-opened, and got right in game" nobody in BoB knows he's a dev, but all of a sudden half of BoB in TS is relogging at exactly the right time to get in to the node early. Once the connections time out for everyone they retry getting in, server/node can't handle all the incoming connections, things to go shit. But those 15 guys from BoB who got in game get to shoot shit unnopposed for the next 4 hours.

That's pretty much what happened in this node crash scenario, less than 40 guys from BoB shot up most of the NC caps and fleet.

I don't know that something like this is going on, all I know is it seems like every Eve server cluster fuck favors BoB whether they are gate camping or jumping in or jump bridging in or titan bridging in. How can it be that every time BoB comes out on top of a node or server crash? You really think in an alliance that has consistently benefited from insider information, from Devs cheating in the most blatant of ways is just lucky? You really think when someone is consistently lucky, its luck?

[MY KICKBOXING GIRLFRIEND]

If this is the case, surely some disaffected former GBC might spill the beans.

There's plenty of those around and yet somehow none of those people ever said anything like that, drop the tinfoil.

Really? Do you?

:words:

I don't know that something like this is going on, all I know is it seems like every Eve server cluster fuck favors BoB whether they are gate camping or jumping in or jump bridging in or titan bridging in. How can it be that every time BoB comes out on top of a node or server crash? You really think in an alliance that has consistently benefited from insider information, from Devs cheating in the most blatant of ways is just lucky? You really think when someone is consistently lucky, its luck?

Are you really so dense that you're ignoring that after the crash there were a bunch of NC dreads shooting waagaa's pheonix while unsieged because the FCs told them not to? I think it was Jake who posted that on CAOD too, not a BoB guy.

[doc]

There's plenty of those around and yet somehow none of those people ever said anything like that, drop the tinfoil.

There's a lot of possibilities where peon will never be aware of any advantages gained.

They just will think that they rox and become true ignorant zealots... ready to approve any molle's shit rp about strategy in the blink of an eye.

[cosy]

imo when a node crashed ccp should give back all ships

[Carebear]

So you're claiming that losing a normal battle is somehow proof that every time a node crashes and BoB comes out on top is not suspicious? I hate to break it to you, but it actually helps prove the point.

Nothing funky with server = BoB loss
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.
Something funky with server = BoB losing turns into BoB winning.

This is a summary of the last 4 engagements.

From PL vs Bob and other alliances vs bob, its always been pretty clean. When lag hits, its a pure gamble at who gets to control their ship.

E.G if 700 ships are on a node, its basically a dice roll to see who can use what. Now if your pilots are flying shitty intercepters, and t1 lolfits, then you just cannot expect to do enough DPS to kill the enemy faster than they can kill you (if they are using all t2 quality fit, which is what they require)

Bob has never been loosing those battles. Its sad but lets admit it - without lag, then they would go back to the xetic days where they would massacre entire fleets without loosing more than a couple of ships with hit and runs tactics at long range.

Anyhow point is simple. NC havent a fucking clue how to deal with lag. bob has spent the last couple of years in lagfests (including entire bob fleets getting massacered without kills in laggy nodes). Goons spent a year in lagfests and have learned how to live with lag. RA and AAA the same.

But NC havent a clue. Thats why they are getting wtfpwned - If you are lagged, and 90% of your pilot that have control are in t1 shitfits, then you are as fucked as CCP's nodes.

[MY KICKBOXING GIRLFRIEND]

There's a lot of possibilities where peon will never be aware of any advantages gained.

They just will think that they rox and become true ignorant zealots... ready to approve any molle's shit rp about strategy in the blink of an eye.

Very good point and I agree that the general membership would be the last to know if anything like that was going on, but there's a few leadership-types around too who aren't in BoB any longer, like Jake or DigitalCommunist (he looks like a sympathizer so I doubt he'd blow that particular whistle) and probably more people that I've no idea who they are.

[Viro Melchior]

What a load of fucking shit. CCP is now creating lag to make bob win. Yeah right. Remember J1V1 where LV, who apparently had GM's in them, could not even log in to save their titan? Remember how many node crash's and eventually a dev reinfoced?

FFS, if you are going to bullshit, then do it right. Stackless IO and other newer tech is here to stay. Reality is that NC is a load of shit players who lived without reds for too long and are paying the price now.

This isn't a case of "CCP making BoB win".
It's a case of "This COULD have swung the battle, and if it did, it's not the first time that BoB benefits from CCP interference."

Nobody really cares that BoB did win the battle, they care that CCP interfered in another BoB battle in which BoB ended up winning.

[Carebear]

Why does everybody assume the enemy has no lag either? Take m-o for example. NC did not siege the dreads after they managed to log in faster than bob. They did this so they could remote rep. That is correct - unsieged dreads!

What a terrible mistake and the crap damage of a Dread without siege meant that they got compleatly massacered. So you know the exceuse insted of blaming FC incompetence? It was "Bob logged in faster" and "Lag hax".

Thats the problem - its NC incompetence, not lag.

[Euriti]

Why does everybody assume the enemy has no lag either? Take m-o for example. NC did not siege the dreads after they managed to log in faster than bob. They did this so they could remote rep. That is correct - unsieged dreads!

What a terrible mistake and the crap damage of a Dread without siege meant that they got compleatly massacered. So you know the exceuse insted of blaming FC incompetence? It was "Bob logged in faster" and "Lag hax".

Thats the problem - its NC incompetence, not lag.

I heard that they couldn't siege because they hadn't loaded.

[Coro]

How many in system?

I have read there were over 1000 at one before the node crashes.

If that was the case, to those who say test things... what other game can handle 1000 people in the same area?

No comment on the tinfoil.

[Jake]

I heard that they couldn't siege because they hadn't loaded.

It was about an hour possibly 2 after the node crash that they finally entered siege when gbc was in siege the entire time

[Carebear]

I heard that they couldn't siege because they hadn't loaded.

A Dread has the combat power of a Cruiser without siege. 625% DPS boost makes a massive difference. yes, thats 625%!

NC were actually telling lies. I spoke to a MM guy and he said that they logged in before bob and starting shooting them WITHOUT siege. They were told NOT to enter siege by the FC. 10 Seiged dreads beats approx 50-60 unsieged dreads. So as bob logged in and entered siege mode, they melted anything near them

A Dread not in siege = Dead, since it looses its 20k+ armour (before resists) repair cycle. Yes, thats 20,000+ armour repaired in a single cycle, and with resists, thats some hell of a effective HP being repaired. More importantly, it looses its 625% dps bonus.

[Kadaj69]

A Dread has the combat power of a Cruiser without siege. 625% DPS boost makes a massive difference. yes, thats 625%!

NC were actually telling lies. I spoke to a MM guy and he said that they logged in before bob and starting shooting them WITHOUT siege. They were told NOT to enter siege by the FC. 10 Seiged dreads beats approx 50-60 unsieged dreads. So as bob logged in and entered siege mode, they melted anything near them

A Dread not in siege = Dead, since it looses its 20k+ armour (before resists) repair cycle. Yes, thats 20,000+ armour repaired in a single cycle, and with resists, thats some hell of a effective HP being repaired. More importantly, it looses its 625% dps bonus.

I was told by an NC guy that they couldnt enter siege because of the node crash

also heard that they that managed loading tho very few was shooting a dread that didnt take any damage at all.

[Carebear]

I was told by an NC guy that they couldnt enter siege because of the node crash

also heard that they that managed loading tho very few was shooting a dread that didnt take any damage at all.

Ok I read the battle report. Entering siege mode is easier than firing a gun. It had nothing to do with nodecrash.

Approx 10-15 NC had loaded grid and were firing unseiged. This means they do something like 200-300DPS each

Bob spent a hour with only 4 dreads able to fire. Those 4 were sieged. So a sieged dread repairs 20,000 armour per cycle. Something like 5-6k DPS it can tank if you add in resists.

So bob was able to tank the 10-15 NC dreads, and because bob dreads activated siege mode. A Clever move. Now those 4 dreads killed for most of the hour and because they had seige mode, they had a 625% damage bonus. So 4 dreads is like 25 dreads worth.

Now NC could tank 25 dreads worth if they were in seige mode, but there were not so they died. All this time they were shooting sieged bob dreads who were easaly tanking the crap damage a dread fires out.

[Yorda]

Would you guys please stop quoting carebear? It's bad enough I occasionally accidentally hit the "view post" button.

[Dinique]

Really? Do you?

Lets just say, for example, that there is a Dev in BoB. To me this would come as little or no surprise. Node crashes due to the number of players in system. This Dev is monitoring the game, maybe its part of his job whatever, maybe he gets emails from the system, whatever. At the same time he is on teamspeak and trying to play in this very same crash. Nobody knows what exactly is happening, except devs, and how the server functions exactly, but lets just say the node reboot process works like this ..............X............ up to point X the node is not functioning correctly, and attempted log ins will be clusterfucked, but at point X the node is ready and incoming connections are allowed and start loading in to game. When the node hits point X, BoB dev says on MSN "I just closed client and re-opened, and got right in game" nobody in BoB knows he's a dev, but all of a sudden half of BoB in TS is relogging at exactly the right time to get in to the node early. Once the connections time out for everyone they retry getting in, server/node can't handle all the incoming connections, things to go shit. But those 15 guys from BoB who got in game get to shoot shit unnopposed for the next 4 hours.

That's pretty much what happened in this node crash scenario, less than 40 guys from BoB shot up most of the NC caps and fleet.

I don't know that something like this is going on, all I know is it seems like every Eve server cluster fuck favors BoB whether they are gate camping or jumping in or jump bridging in or titan bridging in. How can it be that every time BoB comes out on top of a node or server crash? You really think in an alliance that has consistently benefited from insider information, from Devs cheating in the most blatant of ways is just lucky? You really think when someone is consistently lucky, its luck?

Oh please. What if there were devs in RZR? or MM? There probably are, too. Maybe even more devs than in BoB? Maybe, just maaaaybe, BoB doesn't suck as much as the NC. Oh no wait right, all the honest devs are in the NC and all the dishonest devs are in BoB. That's right.

Bob won that fight the moment they gained system control and the NC was going to jump in their massive blob. UNNAT + Outbreak + Evoke did the same stupid thing in XZH and got raped. These fights are won sometimes hours before the actual engagements.

Your tinfoil is so very very old and so very fucking boring.